Photo: Irish Times
Okay, it’s out officially – the story broken overnight by the Mayo News and the Connaught Telegraph that a majority of the players met on All-Ireland final weekend and passed a vote of no confidence in Noel Connelly and Pat Holmes. Notice of this vote was, according to Mike Finnerty who was speaking on RTÉ radio just now, given to Noel and Pat at the weekend.
This is obviously an enormously significant development in a story that has been bubbling under for weeks, with talk of disenchantment in the squad stretching back months. It’s one that could, but hopefully won’t, run for some time and how it’s resolved is sure to have very far-reaching consequences for Mayo GAA.
I can’t, however, dwell any further on it just now – pesky work, real life and all that are getting in the way at the minute – but will post something a bit more considered later. In the meantime, I want to appeal to people commenting to stick to the facts that are out there (I’ve already this morning had to delete one potentially libellous comment) and keep all commentary fair to everyone – management, players and County Board – who are in the eye of this storm right now.
I feel for you today Willie Joe. I’m sure you were pulling your hair out last night hearing that there was to be no down-season on this forum. Thanks for providing it for us.
This is a case of what you reap you sow. Mayo County Board created this problem with a shambolic process last year and lack of support for years and years. Many stayed quiet last year when somebody tried to do something here about it.
Pat and Noel need to do the decent thing now and walk. This problem has been brewing all year. Many decided to ignore it. It was no secret. I was ridiculed myself for mentioning it. The players have been unhappy with the way the setup has operated since the get-go and did not feel that they were treated with respect and given the best resources to cross that line. It makes their achievements all the more remarkable.
I feel very sorry for Pat and Noel. They deserve better but they tried to piggy back on the Horan years and sneak an easy All Ireland. Great servants
The players deserve support though. Our full support. This is a unanimous and hard decision by them, but they want to succeed and need to be given the best chance of doing that. They are putting their hands up and saying that they are not giving up on their dream and our dream of Sam. We need to trust in them. Once they lost faith in this management that chance was gone and it does not matter who comes in, they have a better chance of succeeding. The players will realise that they are not all irreplaceable and this makes their decision all the more selfless.
But the main people that need to go are the Board officials. Mick Connelly cannot oversee the appointment of a new manager. He has a conflict and we cannot be assured of his best intentions given what has happened.
We are living in interesting times
Your contribution Ger Bohan is balanced and well expressed but you fail to state why PH and NC should walk other than that there were issues. What exactly were the players unhappy about? Was it type of training? Tactical approach or lack of it? Expenses? Approach to training? I’m thinking of previous heaves and the consequences in Mayo and Cork. It strikes me with apprehension for the immediate future!
I feel sorry for the players. They have backed themselves into a corner now. What happens if the management are replaced and they still don’t win the All Ireland next year? And it’s something that could easily happen given that most of the top teams (bar Dublin) are more or less at the same level.
I don’t know where they got their advice from or what was the motives. I guess it will come out in the wash. Bad situation though. Didn’t end well the last time and I’m not sure it will change this time round either.
Agree with Ger. In some ways this is the least surprising story of the year. It’s not just a case of the tactics for the 2 games with Dublin, which RTE seemed to focus on this morning, this has been festering from the beginning.
I have some sympathy for Pat and Noel, but the circumstances of their appointment always meant that they were going to have a difficult time. Does the root of this really goes back to the shambles that was the strategic review and the message that that sent about GAA in Mayo?. Doesn’t that fit to Aiden’s famous tweet about Mayo GAA?
The administration of the game in Mayo is amateur in the worst sense of the word – from the strategic review that wasn’t, to the biscuit tin collection in NY, to the appointment of the Managers. If I was a Senior Inter-county player watching this for the last few years and comparing this to the well-oiled machine that is Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry County Boards, I’m thinking ‘If we win an AI it will be despite this lot, not because of them’
Why is Mike Conflicted in the appointment of a new management team ?. Nonsense. He will be professional and will do his best for Mayo Football
A O S tweet was about Mayo minors and appointment process nothing do to with seniors.
I see this as a hugely positive step by the players. And a brave one.
If those in the centre of the effort are not happy with a dysfunctional system, who are we to judge ? What do we know of the sacrifice and commitment of this group ?
We read about it, sure, but how many of us have spent winter nights running into the ground or watched your friends travel the world while you swill a protein shake and go to physio ?
These players have sacrificed too much in these past years to be concerned about egos and “the done thing”.
It shows mental toughness as well as a preparedness to go as far as it takes to achieve what they believe, and we hope, is possible
It’s tough on the current management team but they were holed below the water before they left the dock and they can thank the County Board for that, not the players.
The manic professionalism of a team like Dublin is the template for what’s required and although Mayo prides itself on constant improvement perhaps that focus was not there this year and lads who may only have one more shot were not prepared to lessen the chances of achieving their goal.
The flags have come down outside the houses and shops in Mayo.
We will have them up again next year and support the lads who have brought us so close.
Maigh Eo Abu !!
Anyone who ever managed Mayo at any level wants the best for Mayo football. To say otherwise is ridiculous. Do people honestly think Pat & Noel didn’t do all the could to land the prize. However, unfortunately giving our recent success, anything else at this stage is not acceptable. Fans need to remember how hard it was to fill the position. There is no management job in the world more pressurised IMO at present, it’s success is governed by only one factor, land the ultimate prize. For example if Mayo were to get to the final in 2016, play well having added 1/2 new faces but still lose. What would we all do then?
Will someone clarify exactly why the players have revolted? Contributotors are damning PHand NC by innuendo. Hardly fair bringing up about strategic reviews and about the way Management was appointed at this stage. The immediate problem is that we have no obvious candidates to replace present set up and it now appears that our goose is cooked because it’s difficult to see how PHand NC can carry on after what is effectively a vote of no confidence. Shambolic!
I’d wager the players only want rid of 50% of the management team, be interesting to see how this move transpires. Could essentailly be left with no management in place unless the players have been lining up their own alternative or the return of the Messiah
The players didn’t want McStay/McHale, and now don’t want H&C…..who will it be next?. This power will make it very difficult for subsequent managers, I seriously hope this is not an agenda to get Horan back
Ya, who is the Messiah?
The players are not stupid. They are an experienced and intelligent bunch who work in a wide variety of business, commerce and industry. They are not a gang of young bucks that are pissed off with their U14 manager because they are not getting a game! They would have known full well the consequences of their actions and the possible fallout from it. I would imagine that advice was sought and that their actions were well considered. Bear in mind that some players were being asked to vote for or against their own club men! However, for the situation to even get to that stage illustrates the seriousness and the depth of feeling that the players have towards the management set-up. As Mayoforever says above we need to “hold the candle steady” until more details become available. Was the vote unanimous? Was it against individuals in the management team or the team as a whole? Are Solan and Buckley included in the vote of no confidence? Are the county board included? What, exactly, are the issues the players feel so strongly about? Training? Travel? Expenses? Man management? Personalities? Can these issues be resolved with the current management team?
This need not necessarily be a negative thing. This can be an opportunity to clear the air, lay some ground rules and push on for next year. I would hope that whatever happens, we display some manners, respect and dignity for the individuals involved. They, like us, want the same thing. SAM.
The players have no confidence in the management. They, more than anyone, certainly anyone on this forum, are qualified to make this decision and are entitled to a management that are fit for purpose. This management team are short of what is required to win Sam, I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue against that (e.g. our capitulation against Dub in league, devising sweeper system 2 weeks before Donegal game, only carrying 2 or 3 midfielders all year, not pressurising Dub KOs in second game, taking B Moran off in 2nd game, etc)
Posters here using Cork hurlers as examples or saying that what if they don’t win next year or who is even available to manage? These are all idiotic points that have ZERO relevance to this situation.
The key point is the management are not good enough, this bunch of players deserve better and they have put their names behind getting a better management, it can’t have been easy. I commend the players, as they have always shown, they are brave and they are relentless and all they want is to win Sam. Here here
Sad day for mayo when players are at that. Mcstay,Fergal o Connel will be joint managers for Roscommon. Liam Mchale, David Casey also.
Fergal oDonnell.
Yes but the same deficiencies could have been labelled against Horan in any number of big games and hes regarded as a Messiah, I think a bit of a reality check is required re the All Ireland winning qualities of some of this current squad
Willie joe I fully expect to be deleted but if both Holmes and Connelly are to depart which now looks a certainty who should take over??
JPM, why do they need to win an all Ireland to justify the move? If the management isn’t right then it isn’t right. Winning an all Ireland as some form of justification doesn’t come into it.
This thing that mayo fans do where we decide everything in terms of an all Ireland win was the main reason these lads got the job in the first place. Nobody seemed to consider how they performed as managers outside of this u-21 win. PH failed with mayo in the past. NC had a great team at intermediate who kept getting beaten by lesser teams. This year they look like winning it – when Connelly is gone.
The way to win an all ireland, is to stop connecting everything to all Irelands! Just pick the best people for the job and the rest will look after itself.
We are an embarrassment
It’s not about a Messiah lads, disappointed with some of the posts here, it’s about getting the best management possible.
I’ll tell you one thing, neither Holmes or Connolly are the Messiah, that is for sure.
FYI, Horan stepped down, the players didn’t play any part whatsoever. And they also had no part whatsoever in last years selection, so cut out that rhetoric in a poor attempt to create a pattern here.
No need to fear on that front, Nycgreenandred – it’s a reasonable and relevant question. This evolving process hasn’t reached that stage as yet but it’s now surely only a matter of time before it does and when it does it’s going to be (for good or ill) the most important management appointment the county will ever have made.
PS, I couldn’t give a monkeys if Bob Paisley arose from the dead and became joint manager of Roscommon with Alex Ferguson.
Why are Mayo people wasting their breath talking about what the Rossies are at?
Thought i had left this site for the foreseeable but had to dip back in this morning on the back of the “news”.
Personally, think no good can come of this. If anyone can cite an example (outside of French rugby!) that this sort of development ultimately leads to the promised land I like to hear it. Unless you were to land the likes of McGuiness – which by no means could guarantee success btw – I can’t see the value in this. I don’t think McStay has any credentials that should make people think he will deliver the coup de grace or get excited about. But most importantly I think what the players don’t appreciate is that they have now heaped extraordinary additional pressure on themselves. Like it or not they are going to be painted as whingers by a large cohort of the media – and try as they might to resist it, some of that negative sentiment filters through.
Forget what people say about players not listening to the media – you only had to here McCarthy from Dublin after the all ireland to realise just how much Dublin used it to motivate them…just as it is a motivator it can also do the opposite and create doubt. This is a high stakes game the players are playing because it is not as though they can pick the successor – what if they discover 3 months in that the new man wasn’t what they had in mind either?
On Holmes and Connelly’s reign I think there selection has largely been right most of the year. You could point to some tactical errors but a losing team will always be way over scrutinised in that regard – just look at the castigation of Fitzmaurice after Kerry’s demise. Bottom line is the players could have closed the deal on Day 1 against Dubs – 5 minutes injury time played after Mayo drew level and the players didn’t kick on…nothing to do with Holmes Connelly – 4 points up at crucial stage in replay and….well everyone knows what happened.
While hard to be overly critical of players when you don’t know whats going on in the camp – i still say no good can come of this and players have just put a massive spot light on themselves as they roll the dice – and when you don’t know the outcome, which surely they can’t….you are just gambling with the odds against you. Would ironing things out with management not have been a better option?
Pebblesmeller you are reading my mind today for sure. I was going to post my own thoughts on this. You have my view exactly and it nice to know there is at least one other person who understands and articulates as I would.
Totally agree with the guys/girls TheMaestro, pebblesmeller, Ger Bohan, all talking sense.
I agree the players deserve the best, they make great sacrifices and should have all they need at their disposal to reach the ultimate goal.
But as has been said already, what exactly are their grievances? Were they aired with management before this vote?
This management team has been in place for only 1 year, have they fallen significantly short of what’s required compared to what’s gone before? I don’t think that’s the case.
I’m all for people standing up for themselves but is player power really the way to go either? It’s a team sport after all.
So until we know the full details I’ll reserve further judgement
Kinda feel sorry for H@C they also sacrificed their time to get us over the line. Did I disagree with a few of there decisions? Absolutely.. But I also disagreed with horans so in hindsight this will not end well for us !!
Interesting times at Mayo GAA to say the least
Can’t see how C & H can stay on after this, so it’s fascinating to see who we do get. Needless to say it’s a ginormous decision- we are moving into a year where right now we have a potentially favourable draw to an AIF.
Fascinating few weeks ahead
Similar to Cantini- I’m GAAed out- but obviously this massive news has hit me for 6!!
I don’t know what to think or how it will pan out but I have roared those lads on and will continue to support them. They are the ones out training and working and having no life outside of football. If they are unhappy they must be listened to. They did not do this lightly. I sincerely hope that this gets sorted out as soon as possible for the players sake.
a couple of things here , firstly the points raised above by PJB ..
1 our capitulation against Dub in league,
completely irrelevant in my opinion.
2 devising sweeper system 2 weeks before Donegal game,
this was a master stroke! , its a stick to bet them with now , seriously ???
3 only carrying 2 or 3 midfielders all year,
yes, poor show from H & C , agreed
4 not pressurising Dub KOs in second game,
harder said than done , we don’t know what orders the players had either.
5 taking B Moran off in 2nd game, etc
horan addressed this on newstalk , all the players have GPS , barrys performance was about to rapidly deteriorate as he reached his limit. this “why take him off he was playing mighty” is now redundant in the modern game , point 3 is relevant , where was Gibbons or another midfielder.
so for me only 2 of the 5 points are valid , the point being are we better off if the two lads go? who is going to come in ? do the players pick the managers now or at least have a veto ? do they then start picking the team ?
If the rumours are true then yes the players deserve better than that but this whole player power thing turns me off, I suppose if the county board is not sufficiently vetting the candidates then that’s what we get. The buck stops with the board again.
This is not just about wining Sam in 2016, its about setting up a structure to keep Mayo competing for and winning all Irelands into the future. The structure has to be right and the players obviously feel that standards have dropped. The players, the fans everybody deserves the highest standards available to us. The appointment of Noel and Pat and treatment of McStay last year was not good enough. I feel sympathy for Noel and Pat but I agree with this action by the players. This could turn out to be a very significant day in the future of GAA in our county
The players are quiet right to do what they have done if they feel that strongly about it. We can speculate all we want about the rights and wrongs of H&C but the players know what it takes, have had a year of the inner workings to assess this management team so they are the only ones fit to pass judgement.
However, what happens next could be very dangerous.
There are three paths possible:
1. H&C meet with the players, openly discuss their issues and propose to the players how they feel they can fix them. The players can then decide if they believe this is doable or not. Some will say that approach weakens the management but its the only logical approach.
2. H&C walk as the issues the players have are with H&C’s abilities, and that’s not something they can change. H&C feel they are within their rights to stay, as they are, but focus on the bigger picture and what’s best for Mayo football and walk under those circumstances.
3. H&C with the backing of the county board decide to toughen it out and stare down the players. This would be a disaster for everyone, it happened in Cork and almost 10 years later the impact is still being felt. H&C might feel they are within their rights to stay on, and they would be, but longer term it would set us back big time.
I don’t know what the alternative is if option 2 happens, but Stephen Rochford should certainly be interviewed and players representatives should be involved in that process.
And another thing. I believe the vote of no confidence and the McStay appointment to Roscommon are purely coincidental. I don’t believe that there is anything in the argument that the players wanted McStay and his appointment is seen by them as a county board failing. I believe the players weren’t bothered about McStay getting the Mayo job or not. Reportedly, the only thing the players insisted on was that Buckley be part of the new management team. This was something McStay would not agree to. Therefore the county board knew McStays appointment to the Mayo job was never going to be a runner with the players so he was removed from the process. Granted, the whole episode was handled terribly but that’s the bones of it.
The winners write the history books and the losers make excuses. That’s life. Had Sweeney got his shot off earlier and scored we would have beaten Dublin and got to another final that, I believe, we would have won. If Keegans effort gone over to put us 5 clear at 53 mins in the second Dublin game I believe we would have held on for the win. Had Seamie not lost the plot with Cooper and been sent to the line we may have held out. Shudda, wudda, cudda.
The margins between winning and losing are so, so fine at the level that Mayo are operating at. A bounce of a ball one way or another, a dodgy ref decision going for or against you, can make all the difference between winning and losing. If we had beaten Dublin and gone on to win the All Ireland would there still have been a vote of no confidence?
I suppose the current management team and the county board are inextricably linked in all of this that the question must be asked. Has the last 5 years of outstanding Mayo football been because of, or in spite of, management/county board? Only the players know the answer to this question and it seems they have given their answer.
This is a bad day for Mayo football. Washing your dirty laundry in public isn’t the way to go. Both management and players made mistakes against Dublin and I hope the players are not hiding from that fact and scapegoating the management for the defeat. You go into battle as a team not individuals and I’m afraid that is our main problem. I have supported these players to the hilt but this is a bad move. We will never win Sam until we are all pulling the same way, no egos all supporting each other. We are after ratcheting the pressure up on us next year already. Nothing but an all Ireland will be deemed a success. I pray we don’t end up the laughing stock that we did after 1992 debacle.
Pjmcmanus, thanks. Great minds and all that?? 🙂
If the management have lost the confidence of the players, then they have to go. There were rumours during the league that all was not well, we will never know what might have happended if action was taken then. Hopefully we can now find a management team up to the job, its far from obvious who can or want to take over.
However with a revolt like this the spotlight at some stage has to be turned on the players. H&C made some inexplicable tactical blunders, but some players made bad decisions on the field as well. If we magnify the poor decsions of management then its only fair to call out players in similar situations.
I must say I was saddened to see this news break this morning, Mayo have a top team and in my opinion they deserve the best possible leadership available. Obviously I have no clue what is going on but there seems to have been a very strong bond between Horan, his staff and the team. When he walked away there was too much of a vacuum in my opinion and a lot of mention (this site included) of whoever comes next must aspire to the same level of professionalism that Horan brought to the table and the standards must not be allowed to slip etc. There was almost a loaded judgement awaiting the new management regardless who it was and it was in all probability a little unsettling for all involved in the campaign.
The well publicised issues with their appointment must have been unsettling for the team and without knowing it there could well have been a tendency for the lads to develop a slight shell resulting from a little suspicion or lack of trust. I have no doubt that there are some guys on that team with fairly extended egos ( at least I hope there are because you won’t win anything without a little swagger ) and they may well have forced the thin edge on this upheaval but unless all players have their shoulder against the thick edge of that wedge this issue will have serious ramifications for Mayo football. Time will result in players fertilising grievances and they will fester and rupture at the worst possible time in the future if everything is not properly dealt with.
The current management are now in an untenable position, either they fall on their sword and publically acknowledge that they will not stand in the way of the progress of the Mayo senior team and walk with the thanks of the team. option two is to formulate a plan to dig in and try to collectively find a path to get the entire senior set up out of this malaise.
Either way there will be a smell in the dressing room that has the potential to unravel will
Pat and Noel have been dead men walking for the past few weeks – – they knew well the writing was on the wall – – should have done the decent thing and tendered their resignations and saved us all the hassle of another episode of washing the dirty linen in public. No point in them attempting to remain in situ when it was patently obvious certain senior players would not play for them. It is a shame that it could not have been solved behind closed doors but the CB have to take responsibility for that with both the Chairman and Secretary brazenly denying that there was any problems – and hoping the storm would blow over. The players are only echoing what the majority of supporters are saying – – you just couldn’t have confidence in Pat and Noel – – and while they had a hard act to follow they did appear out of their depth at times.Delegates need to make their presence felt at the next CB meeting and not tolerate the choreographed whitewash that will come from the top table.
Sorry folks pressed the post button in error
To unravel at the worst possible time.
I hope for the sake of Mayo football that this issue finds the best and least damaging result as soon as possible for the good people of Mayo and in particular their team.
Good luck to all involved and people should think of the families who are on the peripheral of this situation. These lads didn’t take the job to intentionally let anyone down.,
Ok willyjoe. Sorry about the outburst
“There were rumours during the league that all was not well, we will never know what might have happended if action was taken then”
To be fair, I don’t think they did much wrong during the Championship at all. we won every match we were expected to win convincingly and we took the undisputed best team in the land, for the past few years, to a replay. Not sure any manager would have won Mayo Sam this year, bar us getting a lucky day (we possibly have the third best squad in the country- in any case certainly not the best)
Nothing changed this year- in the Horan era the harsh reality is we never got over the line against the big teams unless they were AI champs and the same happened this year.
From the outside I thought it was a very passable first year- on the pitch- under new mgmt, we found a new gem in DOC and a good young player in Paddy Durcan, we have a real option in FF with AOS who will get goals ( I still despair thinking back to our FF line v Donegal in 2012), and have discovered a new trump card- that is to play Barry Moran as sweeper, a move which could, and very possibly would, have won us an AI in 2014. I’ll be disappointed to see them go from that perspective, but the players have spoken and if all isn’t well on the inside, and they have lost the dressing room, then it’s game over
I’d imagine it’s more a long term thing though, as this year certainly wasn’t bad! And that’s why I can welcome it
If the players seriously think Mayo have the best players in the country and are simply being held back by management, I think they’re way off the mark! However I’d highly doubt this is the case
If you think C & H made some bad calls during the year, I’d love to see the views on Fitzmaurices AI final performance. The difference between this Kerry team and Mayo one is one of them sneaked a lucky All Ireland
To quote Laurel & Hardy
“That’s another fine mess you got me into.”
County board had this coming after last years shambolic appointment process.
H&C were always on a hiding to nothing and because of the controversy over their appointment, no Sam was always going to end in disaster. Had the county board done their job properly, then H&C would have been in a much stronger position and the players may have embraced them.
As it turned out, some of the players obviously never fully bought in and this may have cost us an AI in 2015. So I lay full responsibility for this debacle and a potential loss of an AI at the hands of our great county board.
What we are now left with, is unhappy & unsettled players, heaping all sorts of pressure on themselves and potentially a manager-less team.
If H&C do go (which I hope doesn’t happen), we are almost certainly looking outside our great county for a replacement manager.
This has disaster written all over it…..
Agree 100% with Pebblesmeller’s earlier post, my thoughts exactly. Lots of questions to be answered. Reported today on midwest that it was a majority vote.
There are 2 questions.
1. Are players unhappy with management or the whole setup surrounding facilities, funding etc?
2. If yes to 1, how will a new manager change the system?
And I still can’t see who is capable of taking this job on, it’s a win Sam or bust job.
But the players are right and I don’t buy into shouldn’t be airing our dirty laundry talk, that a load of sh*te….
The 2 boys have to go now if they have lost the dressing room.
Time to send for Jim Mcguiness. Is he really fulfilling his potential at Celtic masterminding a way to beat Partick Thistle?
Time for him to take on a real challenge now and write his name into the history books and do what so many before him have failed to do.
pebblesmeller says:
September 29, 2015 at 10:58 am
And another thing. I believe the vote of no confidence and the McStay appointment to Roscommon are purely coincidental. I don’t believe that there is anything in the argument that the players wanted McStay and his appointment is seen by them as a county board failing. I believe the players weren’t bothered about McStay getting the Mayo job or not. Reportedly, the only thing the players insisted on was that Buckley be part of the new management team.
Exactly, there was talk o this letter some two – three weeks ago so I dont think McStay was a factor more so the disagreements with one of the duo I heard.
Anyhow their position is untenable, thank them and move on quickly, thankfully its this time of the year all this cam e to light and we can appoint a new manager and move swiftly on .
I dont think the lads done that much wrong as a management duo on the field of play but obviously there were some issues off field, when reportedly 26 of the 30 players signed the letter .
Of new candidates it really is hard to know who would be an option.
Rochford is the first to come to mind and most likely will be a favorite with bookies, but Pat Fallon , Ray Dempsey could also be considered as likely candidates.
It’s not ok, Hill St Boy – at what level of your brain function could you possibly have felt it was acceptable to post such vile, abusive stuff here and then think a simple apology for doing this would be alright? You’ll have to find somewhere else not only for your outbursts but for anything else you have to say because after that performance, I’m not interested in reading a single word more from you.
Carta bui, dubh agus dearg for Hill St Boy! He’ll have to go down the CCCC and DRA route.
• A build-up of pressure usually leads to an explosion and unfortunately the in-evitable has happened.
• The huge effort over the last 5 years yielded great success but all counts for nothing I guess when Sam was not landed
• Surely this whole issue could have been handled more professionally by everyone involved ?
• Was there a full meeting of all backroom staff and players at all since the replay defeat ?.
• The players for the second year in a row have called the shots, no wonder there was only a queue of 1 lining up to manage us last year which will be a queue of zero now.
• What would them most successful managers in GAA over the past 20 years do ? think Cody, Harte and Boylan would stay put and would call the players bluff. You either play for us or you walk
• I always believed we will win Sam someday but we may end up with a 80+ year famine like Clare with all of this rubbish going on as this will leave a legacy.
It’s the wrong move at the wrong time which will yield the wrong results. Who the heck would want to come in and manage this bunch of players now only some jumped up nobody with an ego bigger than some of the players.
And yes I know the players make huge sacrifices to play inter county but it is voluntary. Everybody made mistakes in the replay, there were as many mistakes made on the pitch as on the side-line.
@ Ciaran
Best synopsis yet
Surprised how quickly people here are damning the players and saying “who do they think they are?”
They are closest to the action and shouldn’t be expected to operate off the field without brains. If they feel the set up is so bad that it must be changed, it is up to them to stand up and say so.
This group of players is good enough to win an All Ireland but they won’t be around forever. The right management is needed now – not in a year or two when we’ve only scratched the surface again and we are left bemoaning our “bad luck” yet again.
McGuinness isn’t leaving Celtic any time soon. Why do people keep bringing his name into this? He’s not going to walk away from a well pad job at a huge club where he is highly regarded. He may well return to GAA management in the future but i cant see it happening anytime soon
Well said Baz. Despite what a lot of posters here think, there is simply no one more qualified than the players to make this call. As pebblesmeller said above, these are not some spoilt U14 team, these guys are top class players who want to win.
Why should the CB and management be held on a pedestal with no questioning, everyone should be accountable. And they fell short.
This is a class group of players, the best assembled in Mayo for decades, and they deserve the best management. The CB should fall on their sword for the mockery they made of the recruitment policy last year and then their full unconditional support in the wake of the Dublin defeat and Mike Connelly’s condescending comments, despite it being evident there was discontent in the camp all year.
i applaud the players. They wont suffer in silence if they think its a not being run right by holmes and noel and the pair will walk away now, no choice for them. This leaves us with 3 choices, the likes of jim mcguinness or another outsider that has actually won something, 2. james horan steps back in, (likely), or 3. a buck like andy moran steps up and as manager and gets the advice needed as he goes from a person that has actually won things and knows the tactics required for this particular bunch of players.
Since 1971 Mayo have the sum total of one senior national trophy, a league won in 2001. Something has to change, we are competing at the highest level for years and nothing to show bar that lousy league win. Thank God that we have the likes of cillian o connor, someone made from real steel that will drag us over the line if he and the team are set up right. The way 2016 is set up championship wise, somebody could come in and win with Mayo, and this fact is not lost on the players or anyone thinking straight.
Well, I’d say thats Buckley and Solan gone for definite now.
no reason for Buckley and Solan to go , it will be up to the next manager to decide if they stay , may be they will be the next managers !
It is now time for the county board to act for the future of Mayo Gaa.
Proper structures need to be put in place at all levels of the game and the strageic review has to be re examined! There is enough people in Mayo that care enough that are knowledgeable enough when it comes to football and finances to put a blueprint forward for Mayo Gaa!
The big problem and it’s not just this current county board but the predecessor board rejecting Liam horans plan a few years back.
The current board wouldn’t fill you with confidence after the shambolic way the senior appointment was managed last year and again the minor appointment a few weeks ago!
Club delegates really need to stand up and be counted and don’t be afraid to speak up! Don’t let things be brushed under the carpet any longer!
As for our senior management unfortunately there position now seems untenable.noel and pay are good people and have represented this county with dignity and pride over the years.it just hasn’t worked out for them and they should be treated with respect.
Who is out there to be next senior manager? Buckley? Horan? Rochford?Maughan? I just hope this fiasco is sorted out asap and that the county board will finally get there act together in appointing managers and look at the strageic review again.they got to listen to the clubs and supporters and club delegates need to speak up for the good of Mayo Gaa
[Deleted].
Buckley is gone. It has been know that it was his last year.
I think Buckley will now become more important than ever before. Hopefully he will keep his powder dry and keep well away from the media glare for the next month. I have sympathy for both the players and Pat and Noel for what is now a very difficult position. Yes why the hell did the CB not have the balls to deal with the festering situation for the last 3 weeks. My gut is that Pat will step aside and to be fair to him he has done a decent job on the face of it. The real problem at the moment is that managing any team to win an all-ireland in football or hurling has become an all absorbing, full-time and life consuming business which needs the support and financial clout akin to a conglomerate and we are failing very badly to recognise this and give due recognition to ensure that no stone is left unturned in pursuit of this. The talk is well out there of the recovery and preparation put in by the Dublin lads between the drawn game and the replay whereas ours was of a very different approach. The planning, infrastructure and preparation required to get our boys through such a 6 day turn around should not be exclusively down to the fine turning of Pat or Noel but should be already prepared and ready to roll out in accordance with a well rehearsed plan which is executed in precision by a management team within the management team.
Back to Buckey – he may very well become a key ingredient in attracting a manager from far beyond our county boundaries or within!
Paul Curran former Dublin player has being doing well in management with Ballymun Kickhams and Clann na Gael , would at least be worth an interview .
Other potential candidates may be Michael Moyles, Kevin Cahill, Colm McManamon, Fergal Costello but all are in experienced as are the McEntee’s who were supposedly interested in the past .
Hate the airing of all our issues in public.. however it is indicative of the frustration felt by mayo players that it has come to this..They have , as was mentioned earlier, backed themselves into a corner.. In all honesty though they didnt do this lightly.. A figure of 27 players ( apparently) is too high to ignore..have to ask the question though. who in their right mind would take on this job if the duo leave ?? Personally I think players are possibly looking for the return of J H ..Could be way off the mark tho.. Some crappy weeks ahead.
Not liking this airing of Dirty linen in public but if that’s the way it has to be done for the County board to act, then so be it.
richardmgd – I believe you may be on to something there also.
Has anyone a number for John Evans?
The players would not have gone through this unless there were specific problems, which obviously must have been detailed in that letter. Those problems have to be laid bare before the next manager is appointed. Otherwise how is the whole matter put to bed in terms of getting those issues fixed and getting the focus back on football.
Not too displeased with this development tbh – the way I look at it is if the players hadn’t voiced their discontent they would have either lost a couple of players or the same levels of commitment wouldn’t have been there.
I think Horan has to be the frontrunner for the job but can’t see a scenario where Mike Connelly agrees to all this – he will more than likely resign along with Holmes & NC.
Earlier poster said how this obsession with an AI got these two the gig, spot on. They managed an u21 team that in hindsight was probably the most talented of the 21st century bar maybe the Dublin 2014 one. I remember looking back at the team who played in Ennis last year and if memory serves only two players of the starting XV didn’t play championship football for Mayo at some stage, which is totally unprecedented and nothing of the sort happened since. The tactical sophistication of under 21 is so below what’s required at the top level of senior inter county. Connelly’s time with Hollymount doesn’t look too great given their run this year and Holmes made a mess of the club final against Vincents leaving O’Reilly on Connolly.
Lot of people defending H&C on the back of running dublin close, if ever performances were in spite of management than because of them those two were. Looking back we were totally blessed to get a replay. Being seven down with 12 minutes of normal time left and levelling the game is unheard of any more. We got a fortuitous penalty. Also this Dublin team aren’t as good as 2013 and even 2014. That team revolved around three players (Flynn, Connolly and Cluxton) none of whom played remotely well this year and that was an opportunity to be capitalised upon.
We have a major chance of reaching an All Ireland final next year given that we will play Ulster Champs or whoever beats them in SF so probably Tyrone/Monaghan/Donegal. We are undoubtedly the 2nd best team in Ireland and more than capable of being the best on our day. Dublin could be weakened by no Bastick next year and personally think Cluxton will retire over the winter.
It’s very tough to see how the current management can stay after this vote. Even if they wanted to and had a full “clear the air” meeting with the players to try and draw a line under 2015, any decision regarding team selection, matchups, substitutions in 2016 would be shrouded in doubt by everyone as to its intentions, and that is a distraction Mayo GAA does not need.
It’s obvious that the players are truly serious about winning Sam in 2016 – they’re not entertaining thoughts about “rebuilding” or “transition” years and that’s why they’ve acted now. In their eyes, they can compare the Horan regime with the current one and have decided that for whatever reason they can’t hold confidence in the current management. We can speculate about reasons why, but only they know and that’s fair enough in my book.
One things for certain, whether there is a change in management or not, a revolution in the structures of the County Board as a result of the players views on management is pie in the sky thinking. That will only happen when clubs appoint delegates who care not just about their club but about the county board structure and those delegates take up positions of importance such that other delegates can speak their mind openly without running the risk that their club could be negatively impacted in some way by their words / actions.
there’s no way they could stay on after this ??
Quite frankly my dear I don’t give a damn. Irrespective of who gets the job they will only tinker at the edges and not address the core issue of ball retention, So its a case of tweedle-dum v tweedle-dee – unless of course they bring in Jim McGuinness or Mickey Harte (has the latter been reappointed to Tyrone) – original thinkers and winners
The black clouds are gathering and I fear that any new manager will struggle to blow this episode away. The whole process is a shambles and should all have been carried out behind closed doors.
I do feel sorry for H&C as no doubt they have done what they thought best to bring success to the team and have given up their lives for the past year for the task. However from the start I have felt that their tenure was rocky. To me when they came on board they needed to set out their vision of how the team would reverse the ‘close but no cigar’ scenario of recent years. Would it be a defensive strategy focused on conceding no goals, a start from scratch philosophy with new blood and a restructured team or a repeat of the James Horan era. Amazingly they were never sure. It started off as a continuation of JH, changed to some sort of a defensive game after Tyrone and Dublin in the league and I’m not sure what the game plan really was for Dublin.
At the start of the year the probability was that we would meet Dublin in a semi final. There was a year to prepare, yet it seemed as if everything was only decided the week before. This was illustrated by the side performance of NC in both games against Dublin. He spent the entire two matches frantically running on and off the pitch. Not exactly a sign of good prepaaraion and clear game plan. Not to mention the level of fines he will have clocked up !
Compare this to Donegal last year who publicly stated that spend the whole year focusing on beating Dublin.
So what is needed now is the focused tunnel vision of what will enable us to beat Dublin and Kerry in championship. We have failed over the last 4 years because we weren’t good enough. Something fundamental in our approach has to change, maybe it’s playing ugly, maybe it’s playing on the edge rather than being nice footballers, maybe it’s reshaping the team completely and it probably means improving our kick passing significantly.
But one thing is certain, the current episode doesn’t make the task any easier…..who would take the job ??
All I hope for is that this process is as swift and painless as is possible. Personally can’t understand that an EMERGENCY meeting is being held NEXT WEEK!! It’s Tuesday FFS!
Get this done, get searching for a new manager, and let the lads enjoy the rest of their club season and for those who are finished, let them enjoy their break.
@ Mayo Exile core issue ball retention? We lost because of turnovers then I take that to mean as by definition not retaining the ball is turning it over.
That’s a an overused myth the value of turnovers. They usually end up evenly divided between both teams. Not suprising when you have 15 players of roughly equal abilities.
I would argue we were too obsessed with ball retention and hence we played it safe in retaining the ball between the 45’s when counter attacking, usually doing 7+ passes before the ball crossed the opposition 45, sometimes even 10 passes between the 45’s. By that time Dublin had their full complement of defenders/midfielders/forwards back defending.
Go and watch the Mayo – Dublin games and count their passes between the 45’s and count our passes between the 45’s. Clearly a focus on ball retention is not one of the problems. You need to be willing to risk a kickpass into the corners, not just handpassing laterally around the middle.
Shane – a few points on that comment from you (which I’m deleting as it breaks several rules). (1) The name “Shane” is already taken so please use another one. I’ve changed the name your comment has gone up under to “Shane 2” but feel free to come up with something more original. (2) Spare us from the “really have to laugh at the posters on here” stuff. Laugh all you want but riling others isn’t allowed here. (3) Making bald statements about players being “simply not good enough” is simply not good enough. I could go on about the rest of your comment but I won’t. I accept you have a viewpoint you want to get across but you’ll have to come at it in a way that’s within the rules – they’re here.
What do people think of a player-manager situation? Apparently Andy and Co. have been assisting Pat and Noel over the season with game plans etc.
I personally think this is now a poison chalice and however comes in is at a hiding to nothing.
On a positive note, it is plain to see that we have the talent to do it at out disposal. Tactically we need to get it right on the big day!
Discontent doesn’t happen after one game in my opinion. This must clearly be to do with a number of issues with the management or the way players were managed or treated.
Now it could be a blessing mc stay is gone/going to ros as I believe mayo football needs to bring in an external manager (eg. jim mcguinness or would donie Buckley just take the job…who knows?) to mix things up. Horan has been and gone for example so we need a new candidate from outside with a new approach. Anyway will be interesting to see how this pans out.
Yes, Willie Joe, I think the management team are now holed beneath the water line. We are now at the county semi final stage of the Club Championship,a strange time for the team to deliver given they have other priorities gaelic football wise. I expected something to happen after the county final. But now we are where we are.. It is important to put this matter to rest as soon as possible. Mayo will need S&C and coaching personnel of the highest standard, these people are scarce and in high demand.. They too cannot plan their future’s in a vacum. Many other counties could come a courting.So the sooner C&H accept the inevatable the better. The county board must move with some urgency to appoint a new management team. The sooner the better.
Mike, agree with you 100% – this goes back way further than this year unfortunately. I do have some sympathy for the county board here facing into what is a challenging situation, but you reap what you sow and the harvest is certainly rich today. I also feel sorry for them because there is little evidence to suggest they are in any way equipped to deal with it in a fair, professional and decisive manner, sadly. I also have a certain amount of sympathy for Holmes and Connelly too; regardless of what was going on in there, they didn’t step in to sabotage the team. However if players demand a certain standard and that standard is not being met by management, it immediately undermines confidence in the setup. As some posters said above, this needs to be kept respectful. Their positions are untenable now – they need to recognise that and walk away.
There is little doubt that the players will take a significant amount of the flak on this however; a look at the comments under The Sunday Game or RTE.ie’s facebook posts on the matter confirm that. What irritates me most is that this could and should have been addressed faster and more professionally than it is now, without making the front pages of the papers and drawing the ridicule of the country down on us yet again.
As Pebblesmeller said, I can’t imagine that the players haven’t thought this through in terms of next steps – they are a smart bunch and you can bet they have their ducks in a row. There’s little doubt they will have anticipated the backlash directed towards themselves; how they communicate their reasoning will be key here. And let’s hope both parties have the cop not to let this descend into a public war of words.
Whether or not players should be calling the shots in the appointment of a new manager is an entirely different matter; but then, this is why as a county structure you put in place measures to avoid things ever getting to this point in the first place.
Ger Bohan, you have been well and truly vindicated, and I am in fully agreement with your post above – ultimately these lads deserve so much better. But being honest I still fail to see what would have been achieved by consistently highligting this throughout the season when nothing could be done, and the focus should have been firmly on games.
Team Sheet, we would do what we always do. Dust ourselves off and go again. We’ve not won an All-Ireland for 64 years. I can’t see us being any worse off either way.
It would appear that this move was well orchestrated so these players would have had to have a contingency plan in place . How many people out there are strong enough to take on the second biggest job in GAA .
I say 4
1. Jim Mcguinness . . Jim Has moved up the ranks at Celtic . He is now involved with first team affairs and is doing his coaching badges . A person of his caliber could soon be earning 200k a year across the pond . RULE OUT
2. Jack O Connor . Has coached the most exciting and talented young lads Kerry have seen in decades to two titles . He will move up with them to U21 and ultimately to senior where he will see many more titles to be won . Eamon Fitz knows this and is prepared to be the stop gap . RULE OUT
3. James Horan . I feel he regrets walking away but the years break could be what he needed . He needs a Peter Forde in the stands and he needs to take advice on board but his man management skills are suburb .
4.Donie Buckley . Would only step in if JH refused . Likes to dictate things from behind the scenes but commands massive respect from the players.
That’s it guys in a nutshell .Either JH or DB but preferably both working together again and I would be amazed if the players had not consulted both telling them what they were about to do .
As Al Pacino said it’s a game of inches . And we have been so close but these bunch have one shot left . So they did what they thought they had to do .
Better get in now before some one thinks I’m chasing a funeral. First thing in my opinion, this was fated to happen as a result of the ham fisted way the appointment process was handled last year. Rumblings emanated from the camp since February . Today we are where we are.
Unfortunately I’m going to rile folk again. The county board gave interviews after the semi final that all was well, small tweaks, I’s to be fitted, T’s to be crossed. Do they take us for fools? Did the press that reported this stuff also regard us as fools by not pressing the right questions?
The managers once they lost the dressing room should have gone immediately. This is not bashing them, it’s the way of the world. The county board when they saw this not happening should have forced the issue regardless of their own beliefs. Removed them, consulted the players and kept the collateral to the minimum.
It’s what happens next now that matters. This group, and I’m yet to be fully won overr, this group though are exceptional and singular in their goal of the ultimate . The board shouldn’t fight it or impose a sticking plaster in the form of THEIR manager in place. Find out who the players want, what resources they needed that weren’t delivered. Let them take ownership of the situation. The concept of the manager came with Heffo in 1974. Let’s try something different, let’s listen and heed the men on the pitch that felt that this was the only way out for them.
Had the board been with finger on the pulse we wouldn’t be in the shit we are in. And that folks is where I step out because that’s where we are weakest in.
Congrats on the moygownagh Appointment WJ
Delighted that the players have spoken. For too long in Mayo we have settled for falling just short in our objectives.
It shows that the hunger and belief is still in this panel of players. Their time under Hogan has made them demand the best and that its the small percentage gains that will lead to victory.
They obviously don’t feel this can be achieved under the current regiem and I applaud them for taking action.
Commiserations to the management team, they devoted far more of their time and energy than any of us here in the pursuit of Sam. Their job was always going to be a difficult one.
The new manager will need to be a winner. He will have to have achieved more in the game than any of the current panel. He will have to have the immediate respect of the players and their belief that he can increase performance levels.
He must show that he is tactically astute.
Who can tick all of these boxes?
Kyle, I’m not that WJ! I thought this was clear to everyone at this stage.
These lads still are really up for it. I have no issues personally with H/C but felt that they would bring nothing new or inspirational to the Mayo set up. As has already been stated these players are not a bunch of immature teenagers. These players are intelligent, disciplined and focussed young men who demand the very best from themselves and deserve our full support.No more messing about from the county board let’s put the right man in charge that is will best serve this great team and county.
I have even more admiration for this great bunch of lads for showing immense courage and belief. I do hope that they have someone lined up that will best serve all our needs.
At the very top the window of opportunity is limited. This group have been knocking on the door and have shown resiliance an determination to come back year after year. The huge demands on intercounty players nowadays has probably shortened their careers. It is indeed a huge and brave call on behalf of the players. Undoubtedly it adds more pressure on them to deliver, but ultimately they obviously feel that something different is required to reach the promised land. Each year brings this team so tantalisingly close and their is huge goodwill behind them. People want them to succeed.
@ John Cuffe
Once the players are allowed pick the manager, well forget it, lets all find some other interest in life I’m afraid.
A king chosen by his courtiers will always be killed by his courtiers…..fact
I thought Ciaran McGeaney the ex Kildare Manager would suit the Mayo job if he was available. he got the best out of a very average but hardy team. I say average but in all fairness the did bring Dublin nearly to a replay only for the Ref to give Bernard Brogan an early birthday prezzie of a free just on full time.
Its not good for anyone this. first of all the Fans who are the heart of this team and have been down in the trench’s with them for so long, secondly this must also be very hard on the player’s as they want the best for the Fans and themselves, and lastly the two lads Pat and Noel sure they could have done a better job but hindsight is the greatest science that man has used to say “told ya so “.
This could really mess the League up and worse than that the quest for Sam could be slipping further away into the distant future! has there ever been this amount of pressure on a team to get Sam back with all of this kinda stuff going on. this could be a poison chalice type of appointment. wonder who is FAV for the job.
This is who is in the running for the Mayo Job!
James Horan 13/8
Jack O’Connor 10/1
Justin McNulty 33/1
Stephen Rochford 13/8
Anthony McGarry 14/1
Tomas O’Flaratha 50/1
Donie Buckley 6/1
Enda Gilvarry 14/1
Billy Joe Padden 50/1
John Maughan 13/2
Peter Canavan 20/1
Martin Carney 100/1
James Nallen 8/1
Liam McHale 25/1
Conor Mortimer 100/1
Jim McGuinness 9/1
Niall Heffernan 25/1
Ciaran McDonald 100/1
Peter Ford 10/1
Eamon O’Hara 33/1
[Deleted].
Is it correct that AOS’s tweet was because his father went for the minor job and his proposal was not considered?
John , if the concept of manager came in with Heffo then what was Dr. Eamonn O’Sullivan ?
KL i couldn’t agree more , the county board should pick the trainer and then the players should get on with it. Sadly our county board seem to be irredeemably unfit for purpose, these are exceptional times.
I have to be honest and say I don’t like this development. In the history of team sports I can’t think of any situations where a group of players were allowed to pick their own manager, that was successful. There are many examples where it ended in tears though. Make no mistake – the players want to effectively appoint the next manager. Granted the county board are unprofessional, but the usual suspects calling for “the county board to go” are again demonstrating their lack of understanding of how Gaelic games are administrated. There may be a couple of personnel changes, but the county board will all be fairly familiar faces next year, rightly or wrongly. This is because most of the critics have no desire to get involved at county board level, in what is a thankless voluntary job. Everyone needs to accept that fact first and foremost.
That means the county board will be involved in appointing the new manager. Along with the players it appears, who don’t trust them. What a shit situation. Who in their right mind would take this poisoned chalice back on?
The pressure on the players will be unprecedented next year, and they will lose much neutral goodwill with this stance. Im a big believer in players taking responsibility too. Decision making at critical stages this last few seasons has cost us massive games. You can’t coach this skill – players either have it or they don’t. I think back to Andy Morans decision to go for goal v dublin this year, ignoring o connor in front of a gaping goal and then john small blocked it on the line. Poor decision making. He also failed to pick out Alan freeman with a pass for a goal chance when we kicked the equaliser that day. I’m not singling out Andy btw (who generally makes excellent decisions on the field) just 2 big recent examples that spring to mind. Robbie kicking the ball out to our non existent midfield in the replay. Other players kicking stupid wides from poor positions. These are the moments that win you big games and I think they have much less to do with the manager than people would have you believe. IMO managers get far too much credit when they win,and far too much abuse when they lose. See eamon fitz the last few weeks. Lauded as a genius before the final then it was all his fault kerry lost after. Truth is somewhere inbetween I think.
The problem is the expectation level is now out of control in Mayo, a far cry from when Horan took over in 2010 with no pressure whatsoever.
For example I saw a poster yesterday here claiming that Danny Kirby and Conor o shea were both much better players than Brian Fenton, on the basis of what they saw in a club match at the weekend! You couldn’t make it up! They may well become top players (although in kirbys case he’s had numerous chances and never looked convincing IMO) but to my mind Fenton was the best midfielder in the country this year. My point is that this shows the level of unrealistic expectation that will be placed on the Mayo management team, whoever they may be next year. I hope I’m wrong but I can’t see this sorry episode ending well.
Hopefully this issue will be sorted very shortly as new management need to find a few new players soon ,,
I think that it is the players along with management who put their time and effort into the Mayo Team.
The players have a vested interest in having a management team who can make the correct decision
This management team were selected by the Co Board but everyone who applied for the job were not interviewed
Surely if one wants to appoint the best person they should be delighted to interview everyone who applies and then unearth the best available (unless it had been predetermined who would get the job)
This management team have made some very bad decisions on the sideline.
No change in tactics for the replay. Remember Kerry last year training for the Final behind closed doors and the alleged Donegal spy
Dublin had no problem in this reguard as we just repeated what happened the first day
There should be no predetermined appointments to any team management but i am afraid that there are those in power who think that they know best . A Nod and a Wink
IT IT NO WONDER WE HAVE NOT WON SAM SINCE 1951
By the way the last Mayo player revolt led eventually (took a year or two) to the appointment of John Maughan who brought us from Div 3 to the Finals of 2006 and 2007
Mac’s left boot, firstly I commend you on having the brainpower to review the history of team sports, that is impressive.
Secondly, the pressure is on our players every year.
Thirdly, you are marking out single incidents in play as the reason for our downfall. With the right game plan in place from management single incidents mean less as the players have a familiar pattern and structure to revert in to, this was not evident this year.
Finally, you say this Mayo job is a poison chalice, I disagree. The incumbent personnel are taking on one of the most impressive teams in football. It’s a challenge any real man would step up and gladly take.
This group of players have reached an incredible level of professionalism and for them anything less is not good enough. Speculation but I’d imagine the players were firstly against the appointment and subsequently unhappy with training, tactics, interaction etc.Inter county football has moved on in that players have far more to offer nowadays than just to sit meekly like schoolkids and be told what to do. The fact that they’ve taken this step proves the belief they have in themselves. Maybe they have an individual(club manager currently) in mind & may even have sounded him out although of course it wouldn’t be the players decision
Well said Joe Ruane
James Maloney – can you please read the house rules on comments (here) so you can get into your head what’s okay to say and what’s not when posting on this site? The earlier comment from you that I had to delete was bordering on libellous and the one I’m deleting now is both stupid and offensive to the players you’ve named. Please stop wasting my time attempting to post rubbish like this.
Have tha management left yet it’s some mess hope it sorted out soon.
Mike Connelly will be interviewed on 6.01 tonight by Marty M. I think that the ball is going to be thrown back to the players on this i.e. the reason behind the vote of no confidence have to be elaborated etc, etc.
Regardless, I think Pat and Noel have no option but to resign now. At least for me, S Rochford is the obvious choice. 0% chance of McGuiness leaving Celtic. If there was to be an outside choice I think Jack O’Conner would be a good option but very small chance he would give up the Kerry U21 job – as no doubt he is looking to step back in to the Senior Job when Fitz goes.
Regardless of the rights or wrongs of the whole thing, it’s a sad day for Mayo football. I will stay positive and I believe that good will come out of it. I’m firmly of the view that, generally speaking, players cannot call the shots. However, I’m giving this team the benefit of the doubt on this one after all they have come through. They are battlers and I expect that they have weighed up this one carefully and must have reason for drastic action like this. Let the games begin.
I think we might have to look outside the county for a new management there is a name popping up that lead a club to an ai title but club and county management are a completely different proposition. I would like to put a management team into the mix Colm O Rourke assisted by James Nallen, Donie Buckley and Tony Duffy .
The circus that is Mayo football is back in town. I’m not going to list all the previous acts, as we all know them too well and if your like me you don’t really want to be reminded of them. ‘Mayo God help us’ says it all really.
I’m not going to comment like so many others above on rights/wrong as I have no real concrete facts (about the behind the scenes preparation etc.) to guide my view.
What I will say is that as a Mayo supporter I am sick to my stomach at these developments.
This is one circus that just ain’t funny!!!!!!
Not a hope in hell Jack O’C joins Mayo. That Kerry hure had his eye on the Kerry senior job again the minute he took the minor. I’d say he full on expected a drought of a few years and he’d be the saviour again when all his current minors came through and kerry started winning at senior.
Fitzmaurice however has done much more than anyone has thought, but JOC is pretty much nailed on to take over from him at this stage
I honestly have no clue though overall, Rochford I guess is a suitable candidate. This has surely come too early for Horan, and personally I think that’d be the wrong move completely. Buckley is probably the default early favourite but I’d be surprised if that happened tbh.
J McG has a good gig over in Glasgow and gets plenty of punditry and writing work. That said stranger has happened I guess, but I’d be pleasantly stunned 🙂
They might cop out and put two lads together again, so the appointment looks a bit better on the surface.
The worst thing for me is that next year could really be a golden chance. The country’s real juggernaut will be reigning champs and there’s always the chance they might take their eye off the ball. Kerry are still a work in progress, Donegal are at a crossroads and there really is no-one else who looks like they could seriously contend right now
It’s early days but I’m already having to battle with shaking off torrid visions of getting dumped out on a wet Saturday evening in Ulster in July 😮 😮
A sorry state of affairs, embarrassing really! I don’t believe we should ignore the players, but also don’t think they should be calling the shots! Remember the Galway hurlers a few years ago, demanded the county board get Ger Loughnan as he was the man to lead them to Liam, how long did he last before the players revolted on their anointed one? Just over a year. I feel for noel connelly, he is mayo through and through, and I’m to believe that the players hold him in good regard. I’m not sure what the end game is here, who do we turn to? Horan is the only man with credentials, forget about o Connor and mcguinness, they’re non runners, Stephen Rochford is only other credible nominee, and one who has a very bright future, I don’t know, I really don’t know!! Flags should be flying at half mast in mayo, mutiny is afloat, not all mutinys are bad, but the timing of this one is very bad!
Roger Milla, so the Co Board is an irredeemable mess and unfit for purpose, yet you want the board to pick the trainer and let players get on with it. Seems to be a bit contradictory.
Mac’s left boot, Regards “players picking the manager” I believe Cork won 2 All Irelands after their strikes about management [2004 & 5].
Regards Connelly and Holmes, nobody has more regard for their contribution to Mayo football than I have but I have to say that despite their 2006 U21 All Ireland their managerial record is not inspiring. They had talent filled teams at U21 level from 2007 to 09 but never followed up that success with them. The majority of the current senior panel played under them in those years. Last year it looked very like they were pushed into applying for the job by the County board – after all Holmes had said that he was not interested / did not have time for the job.
Regards an outside manager this idea has, with one exception. been pretty much a disaster where ever it has been tried. Typically it was a Mayoman rejected by his own board – John O’Mahony – who proved a success with Leitrim and Galway. Otherwise, with due regards to the moderate successes of Mick O’Dwyer, Mickey Moran and Paudie O’Shea, it has not been successful. Sometimes, as with Joe Kernan in Galway, it has been a total disaster. And Mickey Moran did not step up on what John Maughan achieved with Mayo 2003 -5, in fact he went backwards if anything. Suggesting that Jim McGuinness, in a top management position with Glasgow Celtic or Jack O’Connor, a teacher in SW Kerry, would be in a position to take the job is total fantasy, anybody suggesting it must be smoking something verrry strong. And who else outside Mayo has any strong credentials to take the job?
AndyD, Jack O’Connor has retired but he is not relevant anyway as he wont go near it.
Reekview, “club and county management are a different proposition” you say, and your right but nearly every successful county manager was successful with a club first. James Horan had a good record with Ballintubber and no inter county experience, there are plenty of other examples.
Stephen Rochford is the logical choice, there are no guarantees of success with him, but its logical in terms of potential and what he has achieved, James Horan coming back isn’t really logical given that we know what he can do and unfortunately it hasn’t been good enough, but is probably less of a risk. you could be pretty sure of another Connacht title and maybe semi final appearance minimum. Has he learned anything in the year out? Impossible to know.
you would have to think that the players know who they want, especially before attempting this. If they don’t then its a bit of a kamikaze move. I would hope that they would also have sounded out this person in advance and that they indicated they would be willing to take the role because unless the county board is completely unwilling to engage with the players on this (another kamikaze move) then the obvious first question from them will be “well who do we want lads?”
If the players don’t have an answer to that question, and don’t have a fair idea what that persons answer would be if asked, then we are in even more serious trouble than I thought.
Andy , ideally the board will pick the manager, these lads not being fit for purpose means we can’t trust their selections.
If I was a betting man I would be looking at Rochford working alongside Andy Moran. A good blend of a fresh (and relatively experienced) pair of eyes and someone who knows the panel and knows the efforts that have gone in over the years.
H&C can’t stay now.
I think we need a good cop/bad cop, fresh and visionary like Rochford with more hardened old school like Maughan , TJ Kilgallon or Peter Forde as a main selector .
Real question is who will be appointing the manager as surely Mike Connelly must shoulder some of the blame and can he really sack his brother without taking responsibility for his appointment?
Did I read, hear that Mike Connelly was also liaison between management and players?
First reaction this morning when I heard the news on radio was, what the feck is going on down West, Washing our dirty linen in public is surely not the way to go. Then my thoughts went flooding back to last October and the clumsy way the whole appointment of Pat and Noel was handled in the first place. I couldn’t help thinking also of that dreadful interview between the County Board PRO Aiden Mcloughlin and the two boys sitting on the wall in MacHale Park. I remember thinking at the time this whole sorry mess will come back to haunt the Co Board, and sadly less than a year later it has.
The blame game I see is in full swing already, and no one knows where this will end. The players obviously felt they couldn’t take another year of Pat and Noel and it was now time to act. A brave call for sure, but only they know what went on during those training sessions in the course of the year, and they obviously weren’t to impressed with how things were done.
What happens from here is anybody’s guess, but for the two boys to try and tough it out would make life difficult for everybody. I think they should step down immediately to all allow all sides to air their views and you never know, a compromise could be found. Regardless of the outcome the Co Board are sure left with a lot of egg on their face.
On days like this I feel for you willie joe!I’d be very interested to see the traffic that’s going to come through this site today and over the next few days,you might even have to take a few days holidays!
In relation to the current situation, once the players have took a vote it’s seems almost inevitable that both pat and noel will have to vacate their position. In my opinion it has become untenable. I heard numerous stories of unrest within the camp from as far back as January so this eventuality doesn’t surprise me. It’s just a pity the whole thing is being aired in public as opposed to behind closed doors.
I have now seen our secretary is to go live on radio to discuss the matter.surely a statement should be given and left at that until an emergency meeting of the board takes place. No point throwing more fuel onto an already blazing fire.
Anyone have details on the interview between Connelly and Marty Morrissey?
I see the players are getting a lot of stick in various platforms across social media I don’t know but at the end of the day they are the guys In the dressing room and if they aren’t happy with the management you can forget about winning anything it’s a mess at the moment but if we get a run to Croker next August and September it will be forgotten. But I would like see Holmes & C treated with dignity and respect they probably did the job to the best of their capabilities
It doesnt look like H&C are going to step down so this is really going to be a stand off. All talk of Jim McGuinness and Jack O’Connor taking over is complete fantasy. The options are limited as to who will or want to take charge.
It is a pity that all of this couldnt have been done in private but then again Mayo gaa never do things the easy way. Is there anyone the players might be happy with? I do feel sorry for H&C. After the Donegal game they were seen as the ones to finally deliver the Holy Grail and now they are been seen as all things evil. A week is a long time in politics but a day is a long time in Mayo GAA.
Perhaps the last 24 hours sum up why we havent won an All-Ireland since 1951. We just never seem to do things 100% properly and we always seem to be reactive rather than proactive. Im off to stock up on the popcorn and wait for the next installment in this drama.
PM wouldn’t be in favour of Andy Moran involved in the set up we need a new ruthless manager to come in that has no favourites and picks the team on merit Andy is a good bloke and great servant but to close to the current panel
Great article by Daniel Carey in Mayo News about where 2013 Minor team are now.
Frightening to see so many them picked up series injuries and a lot only returning to football now!
Backdoor Sam, I wouldn’t be in favour of it either. I just felt that may be the logic applied to the situation. That’s my fault, sorry. I should have made my first post more clear.
I think county board will struggle to get many applications should the job become available. I don’t know Rochford personally but from what I have seen and heard of him, he’d be passionate enough to take it on.
Vincent Neary on off the ball now throwing a bucket of petrol on the bonfire
Nothing personal against Vincent Neary he’s a good decent man but he sounds delusional if he didn’t know until this morning that there was trouble in the camp
Vincent Neary is presenting a terrible picture of a County Board out of touch with the Mayo players – heard nothing, saw nothing, knows nothing! I was always of the opinion that the players were the most important element in the set up but after that interview the players are peripheral to the Gaa in County Mayo!
I fear James Horan has created a monster!….
“Bomb shell” was the word most used by Neary. Shock and surprised was the other ones. It’s not just the managers that need removing but the entire set up seems out of touch. Are we to really believe that it was this morning, this week that the board felt something might be amiss? If so, we have our answers.
Maybe we could tempt Jim McGuinness with a free holiday?
I jest.
I’d have been better off myself going onto Newstalk to try and suss it all out, uninspiring by Neary to say the least!
Thought he might nearly pull a Terence Flanagan at one stage!
did Pat Holmes learn interviews from Vicent Neary or vice versa?? brutal is an understatement!! Would a poll be appropriate now just for curiosity to see how supporters would vote??? Management or Players???
Mayo are never boring. Thank god.
The line that they only heard this morning is being told by a few county officials. The only thing that scares me more than them lying is that I think they’re telling the truth.
“May you live in interesting times” indeed.
Tom Cunniffe injured his hamstring on the 8th August in the game against Donegal,he was not fit to be even on the bench on the 30th August or for the replay on the 5th Sept 28 days after the injury occurring, contrast that with Cian O Sullivan who had to helped off the field on the 5th with the same injury but was fit to play a full part for Dublin 15 days later. Did finance and the best of medical facilities make the difference,I think it did. After the drawn game ,it is reported that Dublin used an oxygen tent to help recovery ( which I believe is very expensive) did that make a difference in the replay, I believe it did. For Mayo to have a better chance of winning an All Ireland this team deserves the best that is available.
Thanks, Juno – on days like this I feel for myself too! Today’s traffic, seeing as you’ve asked, is currently (at 8pm) a bit under 16k hits. The all-time daily high was set at 24k on August 31st this year (the day of the Dublin replay) so it’s still a bit off that but it’ll easily top out at the second busiest day ever whatever about creating a new high.
Gerard,
Unless you are a medical professional who has had access to both TC and COS medical files then there is absolutely no way you can know they had similar injures. It is well acknowledged that Mayo’s medical facilities are top drawer and the rumours about oxygen tents are just that, rumours.
Someone get Terry Prone or Max Clifford for the county board oh wait Max is in jail well maybe PJ Mara so they need media training big time
I believe Vincent Neary was sincere on the radio. They didn’t believe that trouble was genuinely brewing. Check the article in the Mayo News last week where he ‘scotched’ rumours of discontent. They heard the rumours but just dismissed them as being down to the ‘time of year when there’s nothing else going on’. I feel sorry for them in one way. The players have made eejits out of the whole lot of them. I thought he was going to burst into tears at one point. But it really puts the relationship between the county board and the players in a new light. No way is it anywhere near great as Neary was saying. That much is obvious.
Perhaps this could have been handled in a more discreet manner, but the cat is truly out of the bag now and if it as Billy-Joe Padden said afterwards; that the players don’t have the patience to wait around for a management they don’t think will guide them to glory then fair play to them in one way I suppose.
But I will say this, the new manager will need to be a big personality who possesses the charisma and skill to ‘handle’ the kind of players that are on the panel (the kind of man who could have handled Ciaran McDonald). In my opinion it’s not just the management that need to go but that’s for another post.
Its reasonable to conclude that persons of the calibre of Keith Higgins and Cillian OConnor
saw no alternative than take the course of action they took
The current managers have no alternative than to resign and most likely some of the Board
The new manager must be a native of Mayo.{anyway,can’t see an outsider taking the post}
What is wrong about serious consideration being given to John Maughan?
The best of luck to Mayo football ,the players and the fantastic followers.
Are Pat and Noel not gone yet?
Will the fellas that selected them in such a shambolic way do the decent thing and resign?
Are they going to stick it out for a day or 2 or what?
Do we know when the new man will be unveiled?
Will Conor Mortimer or Kieran Macdonald be in the running? Two nice footballers but no experience at management at County level.
Maybe Vincent Neary should have read this website and this would not have been such a shock and surprise, or else he should start talking to the dogs in the street.
Heres a link to Marty Morrissey on the News about it.
http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2015/0929/731226-video-mayo-football-in-a-bad-way/
go on Willie Joe throw up a poll there for the crack!! id love to see who people would back
Interesting numbers!youve a lot of comments to sift through as well with.fair play,it’s a great forum for fans to express themselves, especially at times like this.
Listened to Vincent Nearys interview. He really didn’t divulge much information bar what was already known which was to be expected I suppose. Even if he was aware of player discontent he wasn’t going to say it live on air. The whole thing is a mess and the quicker it’s sorted the better. Looking at some posts here it seems that noel and pat aren’t going to walk away. If that’s the case there’s going to be a serious stand off that in the long run is of benefit to nobody.
In fairness to the point you made, Gerard, I can see where you’re coming from, especially the comparison with O’Sullivan and Cunniffe.
Of course it’s impossible to compare injuries and no two people or injuries are the same or recover the same, and so on, but nevertheless it is remarkable that O’Sullivan played in the AI final and had a good game, when he was limping off two weeks prior. It’s brilliant for the lad and something I was delighted to see actually, but I think it’s fair to suggest that the resources at Dublin’s disposal had a significant role in that.
I agree that it does put other counties at a disadvantage. A two week window is so small and that extra medical attention (whatever the form) can make that difference. Sure, it’s speculation, and O’Sullivan may still have had the exact same recovery if he was treated by the Mayo medical team for instance, or similarly, Cunniffe could fail to recover despite treatment from Dublin Med Team, but it’s a valid point to raise nonetheless.
I didn’t hear Vincent Neary on Off the Ball but from what I read here it was like a performance from an ostrich with its head well buried saying “My arse? I don’t have an arse, if I did I would be able see it”.
If as somebody here said Mike Connolly was the team liaison officer it was looking for trouble. A liaison office to have the confidence of players needs to be somebody with a distance from booth the board and team management.
Back in the days of the Brian McDonald players revolt when the players reps were denied a hearing at the Co Board meeting I brought a motion to my Co Convention [not the Mayo convention] to give senior team panels the right of a delegate at Co Board. It was not welcomed by the powers that were in the county at the time but none had the guts to oppose the idea of their own players right to be heard if that was their wish. The motion went to Congress. As it happened Congress that year was being held close to my home so I dropped into the hotel at lunchtime on the Saturday to see how things were going. I met my Co Chairman who offered me the chance to present my own motion to Congress. [One of the official delegates was absent for the afternoon]. I declined the opportunity as I was not an official delegate but I did sit in the vacant chair. The motion was called, the Chairman rose and formally proposed the motion as apologetically as he could and it was formally seconded. The President asked did anybody wish to speak on it. Nobody did and the vote was taken. There was no need to count the votes and the smiles on my county men were well satisfied smiles. Years later when the GPA was being formed I suggested that had my motion been accepted there would be no need for a GPA. Surprisingly nobody could recall that motion. Sometimes there is great comfort in a bad memory.
Jesus aren’t we all great for jumping on graves!!!
Now all of a sudden we want Horan back even though his failings part led to 2 AIF defeats! Even though in his first year we almost lost to London!!! And, all of a sudden we have AIF winning players playing every weekend if only H & C would give them a chance! Despite the current management giving more players game time than any other management! Plus, I’ll go mad if I hear one more time that H & C took Barry Moran off as if it was by choice, when the statistical analysis said he was spent. As I said earlier, I’d hoped for some respect and dignity towards H&C but obviously that’s not going to happen.
On possible replacements, surely McStay could do a u-turn if he was courted by the players reps and/or county board officials? He has yet to be ratified in Roscommon. Another person not mentioned is Cian O’ Neill. He has pedigree and knows the mayo set up inside out.
@Mac’s left boot – that was me who commented recently on Kirby and O’Shea. Who gave you the right to state it was on the basis of what I saw over the weekend?? If you had the basic cop to check your facts first you’d have found that I’ve been calling for these lads to be developed and integrated into the team for a number of years now. So maybe the exercise of brain before fumblefingers might serve you better in future before making your own inferences to the actual points that others are making…
I think we should leave it in the hand of the players.these players have given there whole lives for the last five years and they know more than anyone what it takes to win the all Ireland .Make andy Moran and Alan Dillon as player managers and leave Buckley and Solan in place Give them one year what have we to lose they are the ones making the sacrifices.Let these players reach there destiny is it not what we all want.
Mayo for Sam 2016
For such a set of highly educated ‘professional’ individuals I am disappointed that the players did not go through the correct process to air their grievance to the County Board. I could understand their vote of no confidence if they had exhausted these channels.
Will find it very hard to see a mediation scenario taking place giving the public humiliation and airing of their vote. Will be very interested to learn what the issues are and who they have in mind for C&H’s replacement.
I sincerely hope that this is not a reaction to the departure of JH. Players have got to accept that Managers move on, have different styles and methods of communication, like it or not.
@highfielder
Are you serious?
Ah sthop ,,,,think we all need to take a step back and settle a bit. ,,, let’s hope whatever happens is for the greater good of mayo football not just next year but for many years to come
Neary’s car crash of an interview for thise that havent heard it
http://offtheball.newstalk.com/player/podcasts/-/GAA_on_Off_The_Ball/107174/1/mayo_football_crisis
You and your polls, wensamsuun! There’s no vacancy as yet so it’s not the time for a poll.
Vincent Neary interview was very poor. Why did he go on national radio when he had nothing to say except the Board has a “mechanism for dealing with this” (mentioned that one repeatedly), and all this trouble was news to him?
It’s thoughtlessly adding fuel to an already roaring fire. While people may be divided on whether to support management or players, these kind of interviews will worsen relations and all parties involved should be well aware of that. They shouldn’t be talking to media. They should be talking to each other.
Calm down, 45 – Mac’s left boot was challenging what you said, not having a go at you personally. You’ve no call to be having a pop at him in replay.
Toto,
What is the “correct process”? To my mind there is no process for players to follow if there are issues with management. See my previous post re my attempt twenty odd years ago to put one in place.
so if the new manger is not a yes man do the players just back their gearbags and leave the panel if they don’t get their way?im sorry but this has made a mockery of this great county and its supporters!!! Some posts have said maughan others have said current players on the panel, Jesus Christ the last time I checked we haven’t won Sam since 51…
I am going to bow out now for a few days until the dust settles thank you Willie Joe for providing us with this brilliant forum we all want the best for Mayo football I wish all sides involved in the meeting on Thursday well and hope a resolution in the best interests of Mayo football can be reached
[Deleted].
45, Kirby has been given a number of limited chances, he hasn’t made much of an impact however. Conor O’Shea, while he looks frightening from the stand, he hasn’t done much to warrant an inclusion. I think back to the Roscommon u-21 game last year…
The team are clearly committed to the AI cause, know they cannot keep going forever and I believe it has taken courage for them to take the step that have taken knowing the attention it will bring. There is no doubt that PH and NC are committed to the cause but I guess the reason there is an issue within the camp is because of the act they were following. JH took Mayo from nowhere(defeat to Longford I think) to being a top two or three team in the country. He was special. He has brought the team and the players to a level way beyond most other teams who have good decent hardworking managers like PH and NC. There are not many other managers out there like JH. McGUinness was the same for Donegal with the additional bonus that he did get them across the line for an AI. Possibly FItzmaurise is in the same league but I don’t think Gavin is…just the amount of talent , back room team and finance he has makes the difference. Cody in hurling and Smit in rugby other class acts.. So the current lads done nothing wrong but GAA has moved to a different place in terms of professionalism at the top level. It’s where we want to be, the lads have been and want to be there again. We need to get McGuiness who would bring the same level of professionalism as JH and may have the X factor. The politics involved in what is happening at the moment, how it is being handled etc is all the usual gaa circus that is a polar opposite to the team set up and would need to be addressed to attract and support the right man.
Now you’re just being silly, wensamsuun. Cop yourself on.
Got a great laugh at the poster looking for John Evans number.
On a more serious note I’d say there must have been some discontent all year but the players gave it a chance rather than derailing mid season. The players are not picking the new management, just voicing their position on the current management. Horan brought an unprecedented level of preparation to the setup and whoever came after might have done well to consult him as will whoever we get now. I feel a bit for the 2 guys but it’s a high pressure position and expectations high. Not in favour of a Maughan era manager as the game wasn’t at same level of preparation in their day. Maughan gave us super fitness and toughness but without the skill levels of the very top teams. Buckley and Cian O’ Neill are top 2 coaches around and Dublin’s coaches are top too. We should try to retain Buckley as coach or if he’s for to it Manager. That’s hoping he sees players point of view. Of the external list only Canavan excites me even though his first effort fell short. McGeeney was a great player but hasn’t for whatever reason gotten teams he manages to late season.
Internally Rochford, Fallon is a very bright guy and maybe few for before current crop like Costello or Gardiner were leaders but bottom line is who can match level of detail and leaving no stone unturned brought in by Horan? Next setup should be allowed bring him in several times as a consultant. Unless of course we can coax him back. Hearing him as a pundit gives me a lot of confidence.
The other thing is County Board and what happens there. We need confidence in the process and if they turn this on the players it tells me they are out of touch. Players would not do this lightly, I’m sure they wouldn’t want to embarrass the 2 lads but had to do what’s best for themselves. Giving so much to training is no joke.
I’d like to pass a vote of no confidence in our full back line , and our half forward line
😉
You could set a new record for hits today WJ! It is sad that it all gas to be sorted out in this way but understandable given the hysteria emotion and pressure that is attached to the Mayo crusade for Sam. The psychological toal of the last five years has to tell. These players are not machines I wonder if there was any significance in the players vote taking place on All Ireland final day when emotions would be running high anyway. We can only speculate as to what the issues were and as I said it’s sad as these are all men of integrity and passion for Mayo football.
Did Mayo blow there chance of winning Sam this year anymore than in the last four years I don’t think so. Mistakes were made every year sometime when we were much closer to winning the ultimate. This year I think Dublin were simply a better team and mayo had a lot of luck in getting a draw the first day. I didn’t think that the appointment of H& C was the right one when success could only be measured by winning Sam! But in my limited expertise I think they did well they made some innovative and courageous decisions that gave us all hope that they might deliver big. Ultimately it failed but I would have thought it was successful enough to merit another year.
We don’t know what went on behind closed doors and what made majority of team so unhappy but you would have to feel for the managers. Any other team drawing an all Ireland semi against eventual winners would be very acceptable.
Where is the players own responsibility in this you could argue. Failing g to put Dublin away when they had chances in both games this year. Failing to put kerry away twice last year and Dublin the year before? Was it JH fault then?
One thing disturbed me during the summer when before the semi a senior Mayo player spoke about project Mayo for Sam and if we loose thus year ut won’t matter we will be back next year. At that point I knew this year would be no different. I feel what we are looking at here is the effect of the psychological and emotional impact of the last five years. What is required now is humility from all and inspired and courageous leadership the kind if it had really been there in the last few years would have delivered Sam for Mayo. But let us not forget these are all honourable men who deserve our support and encouragement. MAYO ABU
According to an RTE News Report:
“We’re in a bad place at the minute,” Mike Connelly, brother of Noel, told RTÉ Sport.
“We’ve got to open up negotiations with players to find out exactly what has caused this problem. “We’ve had the process to eliminate anything like this happening.”
A planned review meeting for Thursday night between the county board and the players is expected to go ahead but Holmes and Connelly are believed to be determined not to resign.
With the size of management teams now in place with all inter county teams, the managers job is really selection of team, tactics and most crucially making the calls on the day, who gets moved , who gets taken off, who gets put on. anyone that has ever being involved with a team knows that this aspect of the game is the most difficult. some times it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Kerry management in 2014 were brilliant, same team this year looked anything but. That is why i feel sorry for mayo managers at all levels, we love to crucify them. please give them a break. kerry returned their manager.
The players are right, if they dont believe in the management the project is lost. The way they set up and played against Dublin was a joke and they repeated the exact same mistakes in the replay. AoS was completely isolated with no support within 50 yards for most of the game. In the replay played the last 10 minutes with no midfield. And as badly as they played they got into winning positions in both games.
Mayo need a manager who knows what it takes to land the big prize. A manager that can get the best out of the players and make instill belief in them so that they can kill a team off when they have them on the run. This group of players are definitely good enough.
If the county board are serious about the project they should support the players fully and do all they can to appoint Jack o Connor. He has a proven track record and a point to prove with kerry. Lets wait and see what they decide, but looking back I wouldn’t be too hopeful that they wont make a balls of it.
If they really are determined not to resign, this could get incredibly messy altogether. we could have an awful winter altogether on our hands.
Am with John Casey on this, I really don’t know how they’ll be able to face the dressing room again after this.
Sure, they have every right to be pleased with how things went on the field and on that basis of course they deserve another go at it next year, however since they really have lost the dressing room I don’t know how they can go on
I feel sorry for the mangerment, but i think they will have to go now, for me Horan is so close to getting us over the line i wouldnt be sad to see im back, if not then maybe rochford
What does the word “lookit” mean? Clearly its the most commonly used word currently being used in Mayo football circles so it would be useful,mfor all concerned, if we were to be in agreement as to its meaning.
Lookit, Sourceoftherobe, it’s somewhere between arragh and musha.
Some quotes below from Malachy Clerkin’s article in the Irish Times tonight, some more info on the background to the vote of no confidence:
Mayo players’ management heave well signposted.
Pat Holmes and Noel Connelly got off on the wrong foot with a panel hungry for an All-Ireland. The vote of no confidence in Noel Connelly and Pat Holmes had been coming a while. At the All-Ireland final 10 days ago, there was word that a players’ letter was being delivered that night to the county board – it appears now that they held off a week as Connelly was out of the country. One way or another, this outcome has felt inevitable for much of the season.
From the start, Holmes and Connelly got off on the wrong foot. A major factor in presenting their credentials for the job was the under-21 All-Ireland they won with a large chunk of the team back in 2006. But though the players had evolved since then, both individually and as a group, they came to the conclusion early on that not a lot had changed in terms of Holmes and Connelly’s approach. Though the players had been to two All-Ireland finals and won four-in-a-row in Connacht, they felt talked down to from the beginning. There was an acceptance from the players that they needed to improve tactically and move on a level after James Horan’s time in charge, but they soon felt that they were learning nothing new.
Small things changed and grated with the players, becoming symptomatic of a wider slippage as time went by. There was a clearout of a few of the medical staff, some of whom had seen the players through long and painstaking recoveries from injury. Logistics weren’t quite as well organised as before – a trip to Derry involved a bus delay that could have been avoided led to inevitable comparisons with the previous regime. Faces from outside the group would occasionally appear in the inner sanctum of the dressing room.
In short, the players needed to be impressed and Holmes and Connelly did not impress them. While it may not sit particularly well with GAA traditionalists, the reality of the situation is that when a group of players in any sport are close to achieving their ultimate goal, they feel a deep ownership of the whole enterprise. Whether they are right or wrong in their judgement on the abilities of Holmes and Connelly doesn’t actually matter. What matters is that they felt they weren’t being adequately led. That being the case, they owed it to themselves to do what they could to change their circumstances.
Willie Joe I wonder if ye could set a new rule that Jack O Connor’s name is not mentioned again on this forum. Even if he was a realistic option I have always found him dour. Barely even cracked a smile when Kerry won AI’s. Not sport for the joy of it only for winning. Yes he won them a few but no thanks. And although I like him can people stop harping on about McGuinness too. Be realistic please.
Wilkie Joe,
Brilliant answer. We all need a bit of light relief. I was hoping for something such as that. Ball well returned to me,
Ah now, Shuffly Deck, that wouldn’t be fair! Personally, I wouldn’t care if Jack had a puss on him that would curdle milk if he led us to an All-Ireland (preferably beating Kerry in the final – he could then go into their dressing room afterwards and reprise his old lecture on how much more hurt we had compared to them). I’d say the smiles that would be on everyone’s faces till Christmas would make up for his dour countenance.
Hi All,
I know its none of my business to be posting here on such a topical issue but maybe I am missing something. I know that Mayo are the second best team in the country by the kick of a ball, I know that Mayo should probably have or certainly did have the beating of us in the replay and I know that either Dublin or Mayo would have easily beaten Kerry in the Final. I have said this on here before and to me the management did very well this year so for a team who won a 5 in a row and came so close to the big prize why would the players do this?
Kind Regards,
Martin the Dub
county board should nip this in the bud,if certain players dont want to play for this management then thats there problem.Same thing happened with cork hurlers few years back,they didnt want this management that management,they went on strick,signs on very little progress made since.Dont let that happen to ye
WJ have the utmost respect for work you do here but I dispute 2 of the 3 grievances you had with my post. I never attempted to rile another poster with any remark which you claimed I did and I never said a player was simply not good enough.
Shane R – that was a different Shane! Your post went up around the same time but it wasn’t your one I was referring to there at all.
Martin I am looking at your post and I am smiling,,
See you next year !,
Will Mayo be able to find a manager if Nole and Pat leave??
Martin Carney thinks not
The Sunday Game analyst Martin Carney believes the Mayo players have painted themselves into a corner after apparently resisting the proposed appointment of former player Liam McHale as coach last year, before Holmes and Connelly were eventually ratified.
“If the players have issued a vote of no-confidence in the management, who do they want in their place?” asked Carney.
“This time last year we were told they didn’t want one of Kevin McStay’s coaches in the set-up.
“Now they don’t want this particular management. Who have they got in mind?
“What manager in his right mind would want to come in and manage Mayo now?”
Is he for real?
Actually I should have added,
Kind Regards
Gamechanger 10
Jack oconnor is a secondary teacher working in dingle kerry.. how in the name of god could he even contemplate this poisoned chalise
Its obvious players want james horan back but county board have to go if this is to transpire…
Rochford also in whatever management team
No that was me posting under the name Shane I just put the R in after after you said the name was taken
Emeraldisle, As I pointed out to other posters previously Cork won All Irelands in 2004 & 5 after a strike about management. They had a subsequent strike c. 2008 but a that stage the team as a whole were getting a bit past it. Cork Co Board systems for bringing young players through since c.2000 have been heavily criticised and it is only in recent years that they have moved with the times and introduced academies etc. So it will probably be while before these show fruit.
Looks like Malachy Clerkin has got the inside track from the players or the ear of the previous manager who he commentates with on Newstalk. James Horan has the inside track direct from the players and the players want James Horan back and Horan want another crack at it hence this revolt so leave all the other names out of this race. Paddy Power rarely gets it wrong.
That was a different Shane (different surname in the email – which isn’t visible to anyone else by the way, just to me) so I think we’re still at cross-purposes. Just to be clear, there was no issue with the comment you posted at 1.44pm yesterday which began “Not too displeased with this development tbh …” and that wasn’t the comment I was referring to.
Willie Joe that reply to the lad who asking the meaning of what does “look it” mean was probably the best one I have heard in a long time!
Paddy Kavanagh one time was in Neary’s in Dublin drinking, and this wannabe Poet with money was trying to impress the great man and was asking him would he take a look at some of his work… and with Kavanagh he wouldn’t miss a trick so he says sure I’ll take look ” I’ll have a double whiskey and a pint ” so he is looking at this mans poetry when the bar man stumbles and spills the drink all over the pages!
Kavanagh reply’s “by Jaysis your a useless bar man, but a great judge of poetry”
Willie Joe your’s is not far of that reply.. just brilliant.
WJ.Your poll should read “should Pat, Noel and all County bored ( yes I know I spelt it wrong but appropriately so) officials resign???? Another interesting poll would be players or management?????
One poll at a time, wensamsuun! I’m not convinced, by the way, that members of the County Board executive should resign at this point in time. One or two of the names I’ve heard bandied about as possible replacements for Mike Connelly were he, for example, to resign would be very much a case of out of the frying pan and into the fire. Careful what you wish for and all that.