As we approach the shortest day of the year, the results are in on our final Man of the Match poll of 2020.
Playing in your first All-Ireland final must, I’m sure, be a daunting experience for any player, especially for someone who was still eligible to line out at U20 this year.
If Oisín Mullin had any such worries ahead of yesterday evening, he certainly didn’t show it out on the pitch at Croke Park. Detailed to marshall dangerman Con O’Callaghan, Oisín was prominent in both defence and attack, in the latter driving us forward repeatedly with a series of surging runs.
It was a performance that almost certainly will see the Kilmaine club man crowned as the Young Footballer of the Year for 2020. He’s also in with a very strong shout for an All-Star award in the full-back line, where last night he was picked on The Sunday Game team of the year. He’s also, with 29% of the vote, our Man of the Match from the All-Ireland final.
Others to feature prominently in the poll were Lee Keegan (18%), Cillian O’Connor (14%), Ryan O’Donoghue (11%) and Diarmuid O’Connor (7%), all of whom battled bravely for us yesterday evening. Special mention has to go to Ryan, also playing in his first final, who performed really well, in particular in the first half.
Well done to them and to all the lads who gave us so many memorable moments these last number of weeks. They certainly helped to brighten the mood in these difficult times, as well as providing us with plenty of hope for the future.
Well done to Oisín, not just on yesterday’s display but on a fantastic debut season with Mayo seniors. Obsiously for selfish reasons as a Mayo fan I would love Oisín to stay in Mayo playing for the Green and Red.. But if I were in his shoes and had the Aussies wanting to give me a professional contract, anyway the best of luck to Oisín the future should be bright whatever hemisphere he decides on. Oisín is not the only young Mayo player that the AFL have cast a covetous eye over at combine in the last year… Indeed it’s true that young athletic talented GAA players from every County are being headhunted by the AFL and we can only wish them well if they decide to go, like everyone else they have only one life and are entitled to make their own decisions…To some extent at least the decisions of the last 20 year’s by the hirachy of the GAA would make Australia a far more attractive option for many, concidering the way is is in Ireland, where amateur players in 31 counties are expected to have to beat a professional outfit in their perpetual home ground if they are to ever win an All Ireland medal..
Well done to Oisín. Thoroughly deserved. He looked like a player who had played in many All Ireland finals before. He was a joy to watch. I look forward to watching him for many years to come provided he stays around.
Every now and then a player comes along that there is just no doubt about. Oisin is one of those
I always knew Oisín was the pick of our young players coming through even if he’d a fairly unspectacular championship campaign before yesterday.
Haven’t posted since the game and haven’t read many of the comments. It’s as gut wrenching as ever. We needed a good dash of luck to have a chance and then Paddy Durcan gets injured in the 1st half! Losing a blue chip player like that is just poxy. Coldrick bottled the 2 calls in the 2nd half with Cooper and Fitzsimons. There’s a picture on sportsfile of coldrick looking directly at Keegan getting polaxed in the chest. He was only 5 yards away from it too!
Congratulations Oisín – it was an absolute joy to watch you play,
I sincerely hope the county board does whatever it takes to keep this young man in Mayo. Look at how Kerry pulled out the stops to hold onto David Clifford. We need to do the same.
Well done Oisin Had a great year and was outstanding for us in the early part of yesterdays game especially leading the rally after Dublin’s first goal. Won’t be too thrilled about the second one as O Callaghan gave him the slip but then O Callaghan is a really great player. Watched the game again today. Our level of performance dropped hugely inthe second half. We had been excellent first half but not many of our lads would get an 8 out of 10 in second half as Dublin managed the game really well and our error count went up a lot.
Well done Oisín. A great game from yourself and your team mates.
Of the counties that play by the same rules we are multiple champions.
mayo have played in 6 finals (including one replay) since 2012. In 4 of those 6 matches, the oppositions first score has been a goal!!
That’s unforgivable and always gives us a mountain to climb from the very start.
An amazing stat (re goals) when you see it in black and white. I think the first goal yesterday rattled a number of our players, including Aidan, who otherwise might have made more of an impression on the game. Oisin was outstanding, I’ll never forget those balls he fielded from midfield to drive us on.
One positive is there’s such a short wait until resumption of intercounty season. Interesting to see who James favours in the coming months. You’d have to think its a 3 year project from now though. The older lads who played yesterday must be mentally drained at this stage. I hope they keep going, but some might have more minor roles.
Paddy Durcan did something to his quad after going for the first ball, James said in post match interview. Said he couldn’t run after that so essentially we played the first half with 14 men. Our best defender unable to run from the get-go. Unfathomable bad luck.
Am I right in saying Eoin O’Donoghue was part of the extended panel in attendance yesterday? Nearly sure it was him in one of the post-mstch pics on the pitch.
Would love to see him and O’Hora in the FB line in 2021. Just leave them in there for the year. Two natural man-markers with a decent amount of experience, certainly in league.
We also need to trial lads in the number 3 position. But who??
Wouldn’t it something to have Harrison, Jason Doc, and Fionn McDonagh back fit. And let’s see more of Ciaran Tracey. Definitely Cian Hanley too. Hes only 24!! He was great in club championship last year.
I know I sound like a broken record here every year, but if James could convince just one player to committ to the cause it should be Liam Irwin.
Amazing stat as regards early Goals conceded in All Ireland finals… As the camera panned around as the National Anthem played, I taught several of the Mayo players looked extremely nervous, I was worried, the energy seemed to be draining out of them, a bit like the times Bruno stepped into the Ring v Tyson… But the Goal shook that out of us and fair play the response was immediate and terrific…A pull down would have resulted in a black card, because different rules refer to different players especially Aiden O Shea and Lee Keegan… should have been done all the same…Marc O’Shea gave Ref Coldrick his objective views for the big game wrong calls, and Mayo seemed to be on the wrong side of all those calls… He was a great corner back in his day, but I’m afraid he won’t make the RTE Saturday/Sunday game panel expressing opinions like that, altough in fairness Sean Cavanagh called Coldrick out, and even Dublin’s Ciaran Whelan (wouldn’t be too convinced Whello would have the same opinion had Mayo won) .. The Mayo man in studio “Borderline” was his response to the blatant reckless full frontal challenge by Fitzsimmon on Keegan. Mind you the same analysts stated that Coldrick was a top top Ref on the podcast during the week, and of course the Sunday Game panel would call out bad calls by a Ref, some would, and one wouldn’t..Now Coldrick not only took no action and him less than 10 meters away from the incident looking directly at it .Coldrick actually beckons Lee Keegan to get back up on his feet and stop the playacting .In fact it was Michael Fitzsimmon the brought attention to the injured Lee Keegan, the game was stopped and attention given to Keegan…. Dublin Joe didn’t spot anything wrong on the sideline, hardly any surprise either.
Might be basing this on Mullen overall Championship performance. Offensively he’s a Rolls Royce of a player and will be a multiple All Star in years to come, unless he goes Down Under. He is wasted by Horan in the fullback line
Ya, he kicked a great score and then made an awesome catch. However he was picked with 3 on his back and his direct opponent got MOTM. Was badly caught out for COC’s goal and could possibly got 2 more. But I suppose bar O’Donoghue and maybe Leeroy there was no one else from a Mayo point of view you could have given it to.
Actually if any of ye are reviewing the Match, James McCarthy throws the ball across the face of goal for Dean Rock to finish. Have a good look!
Look a brilliant player with huge talent but as an outsider looking in he got roasted yesterday. A ruthless manager would have made a change quicker and it could have been the difference between Mayo going in a few points up at half time instead of 2 down. Too loose for a corner back and don’t let the tremendous speed and athleticism cover up for that. Honest opinion. Sorry.
It’s amazing the amount of shite Mayo have to listen to about not reaching our potential.
Big mouth Brollys Derry, have not been seen in an All Ireland final for 27 years. Yet he makes his living from bad mouthing the only team performing at the highest of levels to keep getting back to the finals. The only team to consistently go toe to toe with Dublin.
Next year marks the 20th anniversary since either Galway or Meath reached the final. You can double that for Roscommon.
38 years for Offaly. The list is a long one.
Yet here we are been lectured and scoffed at annually by some of the media and sadly some of our own for not getting over the line. At least we know where the line is.
Where the hell are these other 30 counties on All Ireland final day ?
It’s funny. If we were to be knocked out in the first round of Connacht every year we wouldn’t hear boo about not reaching our potential. We operate at a more consistent and higher level than 30 other counties and have to listen to the same bullshit every year.
The first time I saw Oisin Mullin I knew he was something special, so composed on the ball, just glides around the place under no pressure and then has an almighty bust of pace. He is the type of player that could do well even as a forward.
It was a tough one for management to try and get the balance right in the 2nd half but my mantra won’t ever change, in order to get scores there must be a chain / line on the pitch and the top scorers must be close to the opposition goal, for me this may have been our downfall, i remember standing in the Nally for the 2013 final and in the 2nd half clearly telling the people i was with that there just were not enough Mayo bodies in the Dublin half of the pitch, very hard for one forward to make progress when double marked, but it has been done before.
Nonetheless well done to all players and management for giving us such joy this year.
Maybe the new Gaa President will shake things up, this was a fear of mine when John Horan became President but like alot of the Irish Public Sector I think that former Gaa Presidents have a say in future matters similar to former National School Principals.
Extremely well said, Revellino. That is a post worth lingering on, taking in to our heads & absorbing, though of course we will keep striving upwards. We’ve seen cracks appearing in the glass ceiling above our heads these last years as we push and push.
You couldn’t have said it better re Brolly’s Derry. Anyone can have opinions, but what is his authority? Aside from his own single medal, his county has one All-Ireland. That’s not to disdain Derry people as we of all people value the achievement – but Derry people in general are not mouthing the way he is. I’m sure they know what it takes to get back to the highest level, esp as Revellino suggests, for counties outside the big traditional winners. I let him off with his adulation of Dublin, which I find baffling. For me, his analysis is narrow-minded and becomes less relevant as time goes on.
I would be thinking Oisin midfield next year.
He has a tremendous leap, great pace and is a well rounded versatile footballer.
Pace, pace, pace, pace, pace for next year.
Do I want football to be like that? No.
But I can’t ignore reality.
Benchmark for pace needs to be the ability to close down Dublins quickest players when they are soloing. I’d only allow Cillian survive that benchmark. All others impact subs.
Leantimes-I agree with everything you have said here.
I forgave Coldrick in ’14 for sending off Lee for kicking out with intent(!) as I believe it was O Reilly who was linesman that day who told him to give a red. Coldrick, if he has anything about him should hang his head in shame for bottling 2 huge decisions when Mayo were only a point down.
The only thing that has been consistent from a refs point of view since 2012 is the amount of decisions that have gone against us.
Where can I find the Marc O Se piece.
Unfortunately it is very likely that Saturday is the last time we see Oisin plag a championship game for Mayo
Well done Oisin. If the ozzies call you, don’t think twice about it. Go and enjoy the career and don’t wait around here to let the GAA make a fool of you like they are doing to your teammates and the other senior intercounty players outside Dublin. While someone else throws out amazing stats of Mayo in finals here’s another
1942-2010. Dublin. 8 all Ireland’s
2011 – 2020. Dublin. 8 All Ireland’s.
Last saturdays game was the single time that the procession may have been stopped but it didn’t and Dublin are left now with the biggest task of all, convincing themselves and everyone outside their county that this is normal . It’s not. It’s the result of massive financial doping and a single team being given every possible advantage possible. Kevin Mc stay cosies up to the GAA and rte because he wants to stay relevant in the spotlight as an analyst but he’s selling himself out in the process. I for. even once would like to see him spit the truth out to des Cahill and co on the Sunday game show some Sunday night and not worry about repercussions. It won’t happen. Dublin for 10 or however many in a row that they like and we all are told to sit down and shut up. Oisin. Pack your bags and tommy conroy, enjoy it but don’t give up your prime years for nothing.
Covid-19 has hit the AFL very hard financially. Recruitment of foreign players is likely to be very low on teams agenda as they try to stay afloat
Can we please stop with the Coldrick stuff. He seen that incident in 0.2 of a second. He made a mistake. We were not winning that game 14 v 15. We would have had to have a bench, we didn’t. That’s on us.
Learn our lessons.
Select stronger on pace.
Have a bench preloaded ready with star quality in it.
Possibly take two or three breathers in posession per quarter to not be exhausted in the final quarter .
@JP. He saw that incident in the same time frame that everyone else saw it. He was beside it. He beckoned Keegan to get back up after the assault. Gooch heard the impact from the stand. He made no mistake.
Did he also make a mistake by taking no action when O Shea was brought down with 2 Dublin arms wrapped around him.
This is another in a line of All Ireland finals where a referee has influenced the outcome of the game. It’s truly shameful.
You are correct about learning our lessons. Regardless of the different advantages that Dublin have over every other County, the lesson is that they also have the security of knowing that they have a referee and linesmen who are going to let them away with blue murder. Whatever it takes to put them in prime position to win again.
Where is the GPA this morning raising holy hell about the non protection of players by referee’s. I thought they were supposed to act in the interests of player welfare.
@Revellino, Coldrick has a good reputation as a referee. The fact he beckoned Lee to get up really shows he didn’t get the decision right leaning that he made a mistake, he wouldn’t beckon up a possibly injured player as a ref.
I seen a two car collision at a traffic light once.
I wasn’t able to give a reliable account even if asked because my mind was an immediate blank on who went through a red light.
Well I do feel there is a player welfare issue coming like CTE in rugby in that a sport where the play is repeated high intensity running to exhaustion has long term health impacts.
Conversation for another day.
Well done Oisin great performance, really looking forward to watching him from the terrace. I though many of our lads performed extremely well on Saturday. If we could park the result and also park the opinion of pundits for a minute and look back over the the action over the past two months, the most striking aspect of it all is the players that we were lauding after each game – most particularly Tommy Conroy, Eoin McLaughlin, Matthew Ruane, Oisin Mullen, Mark Moran and Bryan Walsh. (The second half of Saturday’s game was made for Bryan Walsh in the same way as he played a massive part in securing a Connaught title, probably the one oversight by management). I realise these lads have a serious blend of athleticism and football ability but there are certainly 5/6 more lads like them and if they can progress in the same vein in the Spring of 2021 we will have loads to look forward to in 2021.
Happy Christmas to one and all, stay safe lets all get through the next few months and best wishes for the New Year.
Its ironic that it was Coldrick that sent Lee of in 2014 drawn semi for not even making contact with the Kerry man. Then when you equate that with Fitzsimons frontal charge on Lee and Mayo don’t even get a free. Its infuriating and Dublin ALWAYS get those calls. There is a sense that officials go out of their way not to impede them. I think Kevin McStay did overegg Coldricks ability during the week. It was a bit silly to say the least. Kevin is one of the foremost Gaa pundits currently, higly respected, and comments like that give allowances for referee’s incompetence, in this case Coldrick, yet again.
Kerry fell foul to similar decision from David Goff in semi in 2016 when he missed a blatant frontal charge by Kevin McManniman on Peter Crowly (think I got both players right) in the dying minutes that would have given Kerry a scoreable free and a chance to win it.
Dublin ALWAYS get the big big calls and don’t have to ‘get on with it’ in the same way other teams do.
Christ, its not as if they don’t have enough advantages. I think we’d still have lost yesterday, but there should be fairness and dublin should be made to fully earn it. At the very least there should be the optic of fairness.
Agree re the player welfare issue. Lee looked concussed after the impact. He’s already had one too many concussions in his career. He’s spoken about this before including the fact that it’s something that could prematurely end his career. I wouldn’t blame Lee if he walked away from the whole bloody thing now. Health is more important.
@JP.
Referees see what they want to see.
Look back at Lee Keegan’s black card against Dublin a few years ago. That black card was possibly the worst decision I had seen in our battles with Dublin but of course Lee was a big threat.
Lee barely touched a Dublin player and the referee saw that as s black card.
Lee gets cleaned on Saturday by a dangerous, intentional and illegal challenge and that was deemed okay.
Nobody except yourself thinks that the referee didn’t see it. There are photos of him looking right at it.
Look. If you think it was a referees mistake you are entitled to think that. I’ve seen too many calls against us and non calls of Dublin transgressions to even entertain that idea.
@Revellino, to be specific the referee obviously seen the collision. But he made a mistake in judging what had happened. I have the back of refs on these things. Refs misjudge things and can have unconscious biases like us all.
Without refs we have no game.
Jesus another full page of whinging about the referee, its the same after every single match we lose “we only lost because the ref was against us”, cant be the ref’s fault all the time. Its tiresome.
Look down through the motm poll if you want a better indicator of why we lost, how many of the lads there would you give a 8/10 to truthfully, Mullin and R’OD were very good, O’Connors (x2) both done all was asked of them and thought leeroy had his best game all year but we needed to be hitting 8/10 performances across the field to have a chance.
The lads, (Especailly the newbies) gave it a damn good rattle, but we need to look closer to home for the areas of improvement not adding to our victim complex about biased referees and media
@supermac, on the playing side, ya you pretty much have it there. Only in 2017 did we have enough players hitting the 8/10 performance type levels. We had too many 5/6 out of 10 performances even when fresh in the first 3/4s.
We need to own that and move those up to 7/8 out of 10s.
supermac, thats all very well but these battles are games of inches and we NEVER get the big calls.
Momentum is a fickle thing and can swing on small margins, that should have been at least a yellow and a handy tap over free. Instead it was a lifter for Dublin, one of our lads poleaxed and cant have been the same after
I actually felt we were just starting to motor a bit at that stage, Lee himself was getting into it a bit more
I get it, I’m out here in the real world as well with lots of GAA folk who even the most knowledgeable only look at the result so I dont bother bringing that stuff up so as not to be accused of whinging. Well thats not completely true, I do go on the occasional rant 🙂 but here on this page if we cant bring that stuff up here then what is the point? Its the perfect place for it and is a great source of release, for me anyway.
We will never know if we got those 2 big calls what difference they may or may not have made
I also think as a county we are too nice, we have two men in prime positions in the media, Kevin Mc and Mike Finnerty and both of them stay as far away from appearing to be pro Mayo that you’d think they were from somewhere else. They dont have to be rabid fans, but McStay in particular should call it as it actually is, Marginal me hole, especially as he is on co-commentary, more difficult for Mike as main caller. .
Someone mentioned the Kerry incident in 2016, they had no qualms about making a big noise about it, and continue to do so when ever they can 4 years later. Why? To put people on notice that there will be noise if you screw them over. Us? We just accept it and move on. You can be too stoic about things as well, you know.
Looks like Mayo are slow learners, but could they just learn one lesson going forward, Not To Concede a goal in the first fifteen minutes anymore.
Its not only teams that are fearful of Dublin. Pundits and officials are petrified to take them on. They’re all watching their own patch. Its human nature folks. These Dublin players are regarded as demi-gods and god help the person who tries to spoil that or remove the halo. Its not about just winning anymore. Its about legacy, immortality.
Without Paddy Durcan’s attacking forward runs, very sad not to see Keith Higgins called into the fray again; may herald his retirement. Tommy Conroy, with limited ball, had not hit previous form when called ashore. For a player with his ability better leave him on field, backing him to score when an opportunity comes. Difficult to outscore the Dubs without a goal. Conroy has shown the confidence to back himself when he gets past a defender and needed more patience from the sideline.
the Dubs without a goal
Well done to Oisin. This lad is the real deal. I wouldn’t mind the defensive frailties as he’s been shoehorned into corner back just to get him into the team. He’s not a corner back. I see him eventually as an attacking midfielder or an all action no.6. I think we’ll get one more season out of him as as someone pointed out earlier, COVID has seriously restricted the Aussies recruitment of foreign players. And he’d be mad not to go if given the chance. Why stay here to play in a rigged competition and get plenty of abuse for the pleasure. He would be a massive loss tho as he’s the type of talent you could build a team around. Can any tell me when’s the last time a dub when down under? Kilkenny was the last one I can think of. Amazing with that massive talent pool that the Aussies havnt come calling? Must be all those volunteers John Costello/Horan are always going on about!
In fairness to Coldrick I think he was unsighted – I believe there was a Dub in his line of sight between him and Fitzsimons. I know that when I saw it on Telly first I thought it was a fair shoulder, only the replay changed my mind.
I’m not sure it would have made much difference in the end, we may have closed the margin but I can’t see us having been able to turn the match in our favour enough to win it at that point.
Anyway, we lost to a better team on the day. We were still in it with 15 to go which is as close as anyone has been able to get to Dublin this year. I’ve heard a lot of bollox spouted about Dublin not being at their best – that’s the sort of shite that people who have no clue of the game and aren’t able to identify when Dublin are not being let play to their best.
@Dave, you seem to be made of the same stuff as me, call it as you see it. Unfortunately in today’s Society there are you many yes men, will go along with anything, dont want to ruin their own careers.
When both incidents occurred in the 2nd half, I could not believe the none reaction from Kevin McStay, too nice, too quite, he should have come down heavy in the referee for letting both incidents go.
Too many people say that Mayo ran out of juice, when decisions go your way you get that massive lift, fitness goes out the window.
Dublin lost James Madden, the fastest player over 20m ever recorded in the AFL combine.
He is with Brisbane Lions, he’d now be u21.
I think we might have happened upon our 2021 midfield pairing in the final at fleeting moments, would love to see a midfield pairing of Mullen and Diarmuid O’C tried out for the league. Bags of athleticism there. Was only when i watched the game back i realised Diarmuid actually had really good game on Fenton and all Mullins best contributions were out the field also, unfortunately it robs peter to pay paul a bit though as it leaves FB line needing construction, i believe O’Hora and EOD worth another look there.
Something like this lineup for the league…obviously with different fellas getting chances
Reape (knockmore goalie)
O’Hora
Harrison
EOD/King (knockmore)
E McLaughlin
Keegan
Durcan
Mullin
Diarmuid
Ruane
R’OD
Doherty
Conroy
Cillian
Towey
..Something to that affect
Good to see a lot more open and constructive criticism of referees as it will eventually produce reform. I agree with Leantimes, Wideball and Onemoretime but we need a plan to bring about change. With a video referee we have the potential for a better, fairer game where the video referee calls the attention of the on-field referee to look at ‘potential foul play’. It would have changed the game’s trajectory if used on Saturday for the trip on AOS and the frontal change on Lee Keegan. All we genuine supporters want is evidence of fair play and the video ref would have provided that on Saturday. Fair play applies to the application of the rules and also to funding… Someone once asked mega-rich Jean Paul Getty how much more money did he really want – his reply ‘just a little bit more!’ Methinks the Dublin juggernaut has a similar affliction.
Just to add one final thing, I would’nt get too bothered with what Joe Brolly says, he goes with the populist, first it was Tyrone, then it was Donegal and now its Dublin ( he may be actually angry with Mayo for not beating the Dubs )
Remember its not what guys say but more what they don’t say.
Lets face it, all Officials seems to be very close to Dublin when Mayo face them in a final, with some using their childhood Gaa clubs but actually live in Dublin, others have mentioned this on this blog. Why is’nt there a wider spread of Referees selected on the panels ?
Throw in the Gaa President to keep a watchful eye over things also.
The Gaa Director General is from Dublin, as most of the RTE media on duty last Saturday ( Canning is in awe of the Dubs )
I know nothing about Gaa funding to all the Counties but I reckon if one County Board speaks out then there will be sanctions.
Simply its time for change but we are unlikely to see any, lets face it, at the moment Gaelic football is partially dead.
A few creative examples would be.
1, Many Counties participate under their own umbrella, a seperate championship from the Croke Park.
2, Move Dublin out of Croker for ALL League and Campionship games.
A former defender Fitzsimons hit on Leeroy was an absolute beaut, when you get an opportunity like that as a defender you have to line the player up and take him out.
As a Mayo man, Fitzsimons should have got a yellow card and Mayo a free in and that’s it, don’t get why people are going on about this tackle.
Coldrick was standing right in front of the two players so it may have looked a more shoulder to shoulder hit from that angle.
Cooper’s pull down of AOS is the one I’ve an issue with a definite black card
Unfortunately I dont think oisin Mullen will be playing for mayo again. number one target for Australia.
Keeping Oisin Mullin in Mayo is the no.1 job of Mayo GAA and it’s main financial backers this winter. Simple. Lose Oisin and forget about success.
The bench is an issue. Obvious statement I know. Last 20 mins. Not just Saturday, but how many games have we had subs come in to change or finish a game off by scoring?
We are going to have to keep some established players as impact subs. We often comment here saying that’s ‘our strongest 15 starting’.. But what happens when the tanks empty… And that does happen playing the way we do.. But that’s how JH plays..
I’m not criticising him here now, but do we need some fresh thinking along with what’s there… An outside influence.. I have one name in mind but I feel I’d be lambasted.. We had great success a few times with fast long ball in to the forward line on Saturday, maybe we need more of that.. I don’t know.. I think it might be a good thing we are in div 2 this year purely from the basis that the focus will be off us for a while. There are good teams in there so we will need to be sharp, but it might be a chance to try something new..
Just a thought.
The likes of Smyths and Elverys should…or the Mayo supporters in the US should be doing whatever needs to be done.
Cork lad here fellas. Just wanted to say fair play to ye for putting up another savage battle. Ye listen to a lot of sh1t about being bottlers. The truth is the opposite. Dublin are vastly superior to everyone, great talent and all those advantages that we won’t go it to now. Yet Mayo never back down. On paper they should be beaten by 10 points but they show such heart that it never happens. Who else would have wiped that hammer blow of the early Dublin goal with in 2 minutes. Ye have a team of warriors and ye are a savage football county.
I really hope ye can hang on to Oisin Mullin from those aussie parasites. That man has serious potential. Tyrone and Kerry have managed to hang on to superstars, now it it time for Mayo to pull together and do the same. If any of us have a chance of reeling in the Dubs we can’t afford to have the best talents lost to the game. Obviously it’s the young mans choice and best of luck to him what ever he chooses but make it a hard choice for him. Give him something good to stay for.
McGoldrick made some poor calls particularly the tackle on Lee. Can we just accept that and leave it there? Anyone that has played the game will understand that poor refereeing decisions happen during matches. They cannot be controlled by the players.
However, the decision making of the Mayo players on the ball is controllable. Fact was that we kicked 5 balls short. Coen was guilty of 2 ridiculous shots at goal where the shot was not on. Carr tried another where the ball should have been worked closer to the D. You don’t see Dublin footballers trying these low percentage shots. This must be addressed.
More positivity please. Horan took a knife to the team last year after losing the semi to Dublin and vastly improved them. This time it will be more of an evolution. I’d put Keegan, Doherty, Kevin McLoughlin and O’Shea on the bench. Controversial I know but the game is all about pace now. All these guys are capable of really influencing the outcome of a match with 20 minutes to go. Now that’s a stronger bench.
As one poster has already mentioned look at the talent the backroom team have properly blooded this year; Mullin, Conroy, McLaughlin the standout performers. More game time for Towey, Carr (needs 70mins), Brickenden, Flynn, O’Hora.
Delighted that Loftus is now fulfilling his potential – I’d play him as a half forward – and encourage him to run straight a la Brian McGuigan.
This is what i would go with next year if these players were all fit/available.
Clarke/Entirely new keeper
Barret
Harrison
EOD
Coen (Sweeper)
Hanley
Keegan
Mclaughlin
AOS
DOC
Mullin
ODonoghue
Conroy
COC
Paddy Durcan
Bench:
Ruane
Irwin
Carr
KMlaughlin
Would play Durcan in FF line in the league see how he goes. Has the pace/power/aggression and belief.
Meath successfully did this conversion with Brendan Reilly and Graham Geraghty. Reilly player at corner back in 91 and they both played half back in 94.
Need a sweeper and whoever is to do needs a league campaign there.This is fairly clear now given how many goals we concede.
Hanley/Carr/Irwin among the most talented players produced and must get the best out of these type of lads to get over the line.
Mclaughlin and Ruane to give legs off the bench
Great blog WJ although I rarely contribute. We are all hurting but guess what we are used to it and will get over it. The blog is a fantastic place to wallow amongst our own.
For me, this feels much more like 2011 walking out of Croke Park after Kerry beat us in the semi final. It’s a new beginning. Get the energy levels up and enjoy Christmas everyone. Only 6 weeks until the league?
lOOKING BACK the worst thing that happened us was beating dublin in the 2012 semi-final and we played the final against donegal without ANDY who was injured and OUR CONOR who had stepped off the pitch after a wobbly moment.those 2 men were experienced forwards at the time.GILROY resigns AND in came JIM GAVIN AND we know how the story unfolded after that. I am wondering is OISIN MULLIN any relation of MICHAEL JOHN MULLIN from kilmaine who played in the 1985 minor final and scored 2 goals in the final victory. HAPPY XMAS to willie joe and all the bloggers here.hopefully we will be able to attend matches again in 2021.
JP
Madden has very strong Mayo and Westmeath links. Unfortunately I dont think he ever entertained the idea of playing for either. If he was to come back I’d imagine it would be with Dublin. A serious athlete though.
To the people giving out about us highlighting ref inadequacies, if we cannot do it here then where? Do we just shut our mouths and suck it up every single time? I remember the Bullock from Galway lining up Seamie a few years ago for a similar hit to the chest in Salthill and not a word said about it. What is it going to take before player safety is an issue? When someone misses the chest and hits a head by “accident” like what happened Fergal Costello in the late 90s early noughties?????
And one more thing (well there’ll probably be more than one, but one it is for now) can we get a modicum of self respect in the county and stop inviiting Brolly onto mid west, club nights etc?
We look like a right shower of fucking eeijects when he says what he says about us over and over and we keep telling him in effect hes a great lad. We invented the Boycott and he should know what its like to get the cold shoulder where he goes in our county for what he says. I’m sure it wont make him think again but it might look like we have a bit more self respect for ourselves than we do when he can say what he likes and just swan around the place with people thinking hes a great lad with no consequences.
Did anyone see the new league structure?
Having a ref and all officials from a neutral province is not rocket science. Either is not allowing Croke Park as a venue for Dublin league games. No problem with semi finals in Croker. A toss for dressing rooms and part of the pitch to warm up for each game. Hill capacity should be decided for finals. Should Leinster games be played in Croker. Is money deciding everything. Imagine the uproar if the Mitchell’s were allowed play all their games in mc Hale Park
Well done to a fantastic player in Oisin. Very few referees get a perfect 10 out of 10, when your team wins we don’t hear about Them mistakes. That Dublin black card was pretty harsh,I think if we got beat based on a similar black card we would have plenty to say about it. The reality is we didn’t make hay during that 10 minute period plus quite a few players under preformed based on previous matches this year. To have had any chance of winning all players needed to be scoring between 8 and 10 and to make myself very popular I think Dublin had another gear if they needed it in the last 10 minutes.
Anyone know what the story was with James Carr this year, i must say i was expecting him to be the main man in the forward line this year, i seen enough glimpses last year to suggest we had a serious talent on our hands (size, pace, scoring off both feet) but for whatever reason he doesnt seem to have kicked on and he didnt put his hand up with any of his substitute appearances either.
I take it he isnt doing the business at training? Anyone see how he went at club this year? Obviously there is still loads of time for him to kick on but i really thought he would be main man this year.
Im going to get lambasted for this but here goes…i believe we need to consider the option of holding AOS back as impact sub for the biggest games next year. Obviously he is still good enough to start but would be good to finish a big game with a strong team for once, he isnt contributing on the scoreboard and as we seen from the 1st dublin goal when McCarthy tore away from him he no longer has the pace for midfield. Its a 20 man game now and we need to have a few aces up our sleeve to roll out in the 40th minute, imagine playing kerry/dub/donegal in croker next year in a close game, bodies tiring, game getting stretched and you introduce a fresh AOS. Would give a big lift imo. What ye reckon?
Noelin
I believe it’s Meath, Westmeath and Mayo with another county that I cannot recall. I stand to be corrected but that’s what I seen somewhere recently
Agree with you Supermac on both accounts. Carr last year looked like a player that was going to be a regular started this year and almost unmarkable with his size and pace. Not sure has he had injuries this year but physically the last day his strength and conditioning seemed to have gone backwards. He still has the skill and youth on his side – but like Stephen Coen and Conor Loftus did this year – he needs to up it big time next year.
I think Aidan will be 31 next year. Hold him in reserve and have a fresh Aidan for the last 30 minutes – not a man that is after running out of steam with 30 minutes to go.
Some people give out about Aidans contribution – but I think his contribution will only be really appreciated when he is retired
I would agree supermac. When we play Dublin he doesn’t have the pace for MF and he hasn’t scored in 5 finals so is he worth a start in the forwards again? Horan spotted some weaknesses after last year around the middle but he needs to look at this too. Division 2 will be ideal to give the likes of Carr, towey and others full games. We need scoring forwards.
One other thing has Higgins regressed so much that he wasn’t the man to come on at halftime and use his experience to punch holes in Dublin. Plunket just seems average at everything but where’s the pace, athleticism, power?
Well done Oisin, superb further out the field, however we have been playing himself and Keegan in the full back line as stop gaps really when they are both more natural half backs, or even center field in the case of Mullin.
Hard to take another AI Final defeat, however one thing that annoys me is the line that ‘Kerry and Donegal must be kicking themselves’ – yeah it’s easy to be a better challenger when you are sitting on your potential arse on final day.
We did a lot of things right the last night and management and players have to take great credit for this, particularly the kick-outs and nullifying midfield for long periods of the game. But there are a two big niggling things for me that we consistently cant seem to address and that is concession of goals (particularly early goals) and our end of game management.
Hate to say it, but in relation to the above issues, I think there is a significant phycological element that has to be addressed if we are ever going to get over the line. Yeah its not as tangible as addressing a kick-out or match-ups which are very evident, but its lingering there and is the elephant in the room. Its almost like we are more comfortable when we have the adversity of a concession of an early goal – i.e. would we have tacked on 3 points in as many minutes if Dublin hadn’t got the early goal? Physiologically we seem more comfortable chasing – its more comfortable physiologically. After getting those 3 points and getting level we obviously had momentum, however we weren’t comfortable to build on it. It happens also with lesser opposition as we all know, however more often than not we can just about overcome that, but not with Dublin.
End of game management, and I don’t just mean the subs we bring on (which is an issue), but how the players on the pitch manage it be they starters or subs – when the end line is almost in sight, errors start, pot shots at the posts happen, tackles go awry – I think this is a critical issue Mayo have to address if we are ever going to succeed. Its almost like around the last time we were level, you could feel a physiological switch flick and we all felt, if we are being honest, that we could script the last 10-15 minutes.
This is our biggest issue…..I hate to throw this out there, but if it was a Donegal, Tyrone, Kerry, even a Cavan or Galway there against us last Saturday, I still think the same issue would emerge.
Agree with first gen Dub, all about pace, impact subs that he named is the way to go, its not all doom and gloom, it’s following the same trajectory as Horans first stint and we are building a powerful team, hope we can keep Oisín but one player won’t get us over the line but we can’t afford to be losing them either
Horans template of pace is on the right lines so anybody who doesn’t have pace you can forget it. Someone mentioned earlier and I agree Cillian and aido are the only exceptions. Unfortunately that includes the likes of e.g Liam Irwin who might be very good forwards but not overly fast. The game has changed so much in the last few years.
Dublin are the template to follow – they have attacking threats from corner back to corner forwards. Our athleticism and fitness needs to improve and playing in division 2 might give us a chance to play some newbies while resting our more established players while also taking on more strength and conditioning work in preparation for championship in 4-5 months time. Our fitness faltered badly in the last 15 minutes on Saturday – imagine if there was extra time we wouldn’t have stood a chance. This has to be a priority
So it looks like it Mayo, Meath, Westmeath and Down will make up division 2 North for the league. The fixtures would be played on a drawn lottery type thing. To see who plays where. Top 2 from fusion 2 north would go into a league semi with top 2 from division 2 south and then a division 2 final played in the first week of April.
Championship would start in late April and wrap up in July. Provincial system again but this time followed by qualifiers for the top teams in the top 3 divisions.
The GAA are going to announce it officially before long.
The question is this, if things went Mayos way, and it could happen that they will, is 7 months long enough to build extra stamina into players? while trying to get out of division 2 and also trying to win a provincial title to avoid qualifiers?
I’m terrible at relaying information clearly , but Pundit arena have it on their page if you want to google it.
@Dave.
I was just wondering something along the same lines.
We uncovered great talent in the past year.
Should we use the league campaign uncovering more new talent or should the emphasis be put on gaining promotion.
Personally I would use it to try and find 2 or 3 new lads but some might think that moving back up to Div 1 is more important.
@Dave, .. Stamina, yes we need to improve there…We used up an awful lot of energy in the first half, and in general dominated the game, but went in 2 points down.. The concession of 2 very soft Goals has to burn off allot of emotional energy as well.. The way Dublin absolutely sap the energy out of their opponents by their manipulation of the Ball possession, this would not be nearly as effective if Dublin were facing a deficit on the scoreboard…In the All Ireland Final we were down two points but up a man for the start of the third quarter, but from the throw in Dublin monopolised possession for the first 3 minutes and we ran around after them all over the Park, and Dublin got the first score of the third quarter, definitely not the best way to concerve energy…We need to learn and learn quickly… But a bigger issue for me would be the amount of until very recently fully fit players, who were unavailable by the time the All Ireland came around and subsequently unavailable due to injury..
Watched the game over again, lots to be positive about and we were not far away at all, the winning and losing in my mind
– Aido caught for pace with McCarthy on 1st goal (Aido did have a good game overall)
– 4 shots dropped into Cluxtons hands (2 at least should have been scores)
– Minimum a free and a point for Leroy’s tackle
– Aido had the ball in front of goal surrounded by 2-3 dubs with ROD free to his right – it was a certain point if he
tapped the ball to him if not a goal chance.
– E McLaughlins run on goal after the last water break – he should have gotten something from it a free, a point.
– A pass from DOC to Darren misjudged and ball ended over the line when in an attacking position – gave possession and an attack to Dublin.
If a couple of the above went in our favour you have a decent points swing that would have made us winners. Small margins indeed but with improvement likely next yr from the new lads there is loads to be optimistic about..Outlook is good very good indeed…
All fair points darkyfinn but I don’t think them points would have made us the winners. Dublin played a possession based game, if they needed to they could have pushed more for scores at the other end. I’m not saying they would have got them but we were out of gas at the end so with their superior fitness they probably would.
One definite, if aido and D’OC go in for the throw in then mattie and loftus could go into the forwards for this but…and I can’t emphasise this enough… Kevin McLoughlin needs to sit behind our 6 in a sweeper role for these periods. It would cut out those early goals
Can anyone please tell me what injury did Paddy Durcan pick up in the match ? This seems to be a well kept secret. I’m not yet ready to watch the game again.
Fact, at least 5 more new starters are need to inject more life into this team the average age of the team needs to be reduced.
Why is there no more tight marking corner backs in the game, on a one on one situation ?, has this died with the over emphasis of the blanket defence.
Mayo will win the All Ireland someday.
It’s a great testament that managers come back a second time, ie O Mahony, Maughan and Horan all should be commended.
The way to counter in the future a team playing down the clock when 14 v 15 is to have a Goalie comfortable in playing outfield type in goals far off their line giving a more effective press. The likelihood of a lobbed goal is remote, the likelihood of losing precious clock time is 100% if not countered.
I think also you need plenty long rangey athletes like Diarmuid and Cian Hanley. Very high repeatable speed endurance and long frames for intercepts and tackles.
Well done to Oisin. Fantastic player.
I think the real issue with Dublin’s dominance is why would an elite athelete like Oisin wait around in Ireland to suffer 10-12 years of dissapointment trying to win an AI when he can have a successful career in professional sports in Oz.
And that’s a Mayo player, who are in the Top 3-4 for the last 30 years. Imagine how easy the decsion would be if Oisin was born in Sligo or Leitrim (no disrespect to either but not a chance that either will ever win an AI under the current format.)
If I was in recruitment for Aussie Rule, Irish Rugby etc focusing on elite 15-17 year olds in rural Ireland that is my biggest card to play – What are you, as an elite athelete, going to have to show for your career in Gaelic football `? – bacuase it sure wont be an AI medal if you are born outside Dublin and Kerry.
There are no harsh questions been asked though, for example what was the point in having , sos,Vaughan, Boyle and Higgins involved this year ? What does darren Coen offer , towey of charlestown would be a better option? What became of eoin o Donoghue? Surely it would of been to the betterment of the team to have eoin o Donoghue in there and give ya the option of playing either Mullen or keegan further up .
Sean Burke while I agree with your point on Towey, I can’t agree with your questioning of having the more senior players involved in the set up. You can’t underestimate how vital that is for setting standards and what’s expected of the younger lads. The training games would bring them on loads. If there was a mass exodus prior to incorporating the young lads, standards would most certainly drop and we wouldn’t have a hope of even winning Connacht. Young lads also get great confidence from earning a jersey over someone whose been in the panel for years. This is why it’s called a transition period and allows us to stay consistently competitive.
Fair enough, not sure I agree though , plenty of experience in players that are still central to the team .
It’s no secret, Mayo88 – James Horan said after the game that Paddy picked up a quad injury very early in the game. I think a number of others here have already confirmed that.
While Oisin Mullen had a fine game going forward, his man absolutely skinned him at the back. He should not have been put on Con O’Callaghan. Until we learn how to defend, I’m afraid we are going nowhere. Both Dublin goals came from naïve defending and probably cost us the game in the end.
Leantimes……………….Contributors’ analyses here since the AIF is covering many aspects of the game last Saturday and very interesting individual and team specifics that could be tweaked. But that piece of yours on ‘stamina’ very much strikes a chord with me. Very well considered and reasoned. Our lads certainly were ‘up for it’, no real nerves on show, just going about the business of squaring up to the Dubs and trying to keep toe to toe until the business end, which, some mistakes aside, they made a great job of. But, as you point out, all of that saps the energy out of the runners and we saw that in the final 8-10 mins. Dubs well know that unlike most other counties, their subs bench is an interchangeable tier 1 gang of lads (who might as well have all been starting) and when they’re sprung, fresh legged, and very talented, they’re bound to make an impact. …………..But all of that is a given, a fact that won’t change – so as you say, all we can do is continuously study, analyse and learn how to overcome their strengths and win these clashes. Excellent piece, I enjoyed it.
I think there were a few passengers in our subs on Sat night. When I saw the full 26 for both teams before the match it was certainly advantage Dublin.
The two forwards that James Horan brought on completely changed the dynamic of the forward play. Both are slow and like to hold the ball up. This slows everything down and allows the opposition to regroup. We need more Conroy’s & ROD’s – forwards with a first instinct to take their man on and skin them. The reason this works is that if they don’t get past their man they are hauled down and Cillian converts. By the way at Toweys cameo in Clones last Feb he was fed two balls and his first instinct was ‘I’m taking my man on’.
Coen has carved out a reputation as an accurate forward at club level but he has no pace. Carr is a great carrier of the ball (Limerick ‘19) however he seems to need 3 chances to convert one score. Has he ever togged at full forward? With his size & skill I’d like to see him in there for a full match.
The personnel is there – it just needs more imagination from management.
@Martyk – stamina is immaterial at 60minutes. Pace pace pace. Bring on subs with pace to run hard and straight at the Dubs. It spooks them.
Thanks Willie Joe, I missed that was too caught up in the action, and didnt look at anything about the game after the final whistle was blown
Well done Oisín – fantastic game, fantastic season.
Can’t understand how Coldrick is getting such sympathy here. Dublin scored 2:14, a very beatable score. Being denied two points when we were the victims of strong arm Dublin challenges, made a huge difference. Think of the energy we would have got from those scores.
Of course other areas were in our own hands. Think of that, the two critical areas, the bench and the balls dropped into the keeper’s hands. Dublin didn’t force that on us. Those balls (5 Darkyfinn I think, but others may verify this) were unforced errors, and were far worse than wides; they enabled Dublin counter-attacks, which really kill a team.
Others have mentioned the bench, and I think this is where James’s policy unravelled. The strategy of in-form players making the 26 each time ensured no one could build up an impact sub role. We really needed an oldie I felt in the last quarter to gain possession, use vast experience and lend authority and structure for those critical minutes: think Boyler (not on the 26), Keith, Seamie. The argument that they weren’t good enough to make the 26 has to be set against their experience of finals and of those crucial last minutes. You can’t buy that.
Bryan Walsh and Mark Moran were big losses. They are pacey senior club players used to playing systematic modem football.
Oisin is an extreme outlier from junior club football. Although Kilmaine now Intermediate.
Totally agree with you there, First Gen Dub. I know none of us see training and it may not have made any difference with the result but bringing on players with absolutely no pace (Coen, Flynn, Plunkett) when you have Towey, Boland and Higgins on the bench is beyond me. I know Towey wasn’t actually selected on Sat. The subs he brought on never make things happen (bar Coen when he has lots of space and the game is really open) whereas Boland is brilliant at collecting breaking ball, winning frees, and scoring from distance. Towey always takes his man on and wins frees, creates chances. Higgins is the closest thing we have to a replacement for Paddy. He can put Dublin on the back foot. Flynn is absolutely not at county level in terms of pace and athleticism – Parsons must have gone way back not to get on ahead.
I would give Mullin,Durcan and Cian Hanley game time in the forwards in the league. Fellas who have pace and can score. one or two of them would probably come through.
I agree with posters who think Keith was an obvious sub to come on for last quarter when we were starting to wilt. Still has plenty of pace,decision making usually good, was obviously up for the fight, re putting manners on the Ballymun bully at h.t. Plunkett is safe but we needed more go forward momentum. I would worry for Carr’s progression if he isn’t playing club football at a higher level. Cathal Horan was another I expected to see more of,but again needs to be playing against the best in the county to progress. I really hope we see those lads and 3/4 more young Knockmore lads get serious game time in the national league
Lads back training on 15th January. Maybe the older lads will get some more time off. NFL Division 2 North starts the last weekend of February. Down, Meath and Westmeath in our group. Finish in the top two and we will need to win a semi final against either Cork, Laois, Clare or Kildare to guarantee a return to Division 1. Minds should be focused quicky on that task with also the chance to blood a few more young bucks.
The fact Carr is playing junior club football shouldn’t be an issue. He’s been with the seniors since 2017 so has got plenty exposure to high level football. His main problem is staying free of injuries. If he’s missing training it’s impossible to get a run of games and form will suffer.
I was disappointed with both Dublin goals. We had plenty of defenders but they all seemed to watch the guy with the ball and nobody seemed to notice or pick up rock or O’Callaghan when they positioned themselves in front of our goal.
I felt both goals could have been prevented with basic enough defending.
Main problem with the goal was the nonsensical tactic we had for throw in . Horses for courses
@Wide ball, with any team sport it’s the contests in the arena that really develop your confidence and ability. James Carr has had had very little game time with Mayo. It cannot be ignored that playing junior club football does hold him back. Oisin is an unusual outlier. Oisin did however get extra coaching and high level games with Ballinrobe CBS when developing.
There’s a trend where most our young talent are also attending our strong football schools.
Cian Hanley if his body holds up and he can commit is an obvious athlete footballer for this team.
The selection of slow subs was one more harsh lesson learned. Eamon Coughlan talked about taking care very well in preparation of the big basics before worrying about the minute details.
I can’t for the life of me understand how near enough our slowest subs were the ones used ahead of OHora, Higgins, Boland against the quickest team in the country.
Two lessons for Mayo to learn from that game and if they don’t they will never win anything, 1. Stop conceding early goals in games 2. Have your best team on the field at the end of the game., no point in bringing on subs unless they are able to take control of the game when they come on .
O’Callaghan’s ability to turn on the legendary sixpence and break with lightening pace makes him a nightmare to mark, probably impossible to mark through a full game and impossible to stop when he is running at you. What do you do if you are a corner back and he is running through on goal? Mark your own man and watch O’Callaghan score or try to cover him and leave your own man free?
Saturday’s game is done and dusted and it would seem the next few? championships are done and dusted too? Who is going to stop Dublin? Kerry? The Kerry who lost to Cork who then lost to Tipp? The Donegal who lost to Cavan?
It seems strange to me that the Australians have not seen one footballer in Dublin in the last 6 -7 years worth a trial in Aussieland. Is it perhaps that the Aussies cannot afford a Dub? That AIG have upped the ante so much? It seems even stranger that nobody in Ireland- apart from myself – journalist or pundit, find this strange. But it cannot be a money issue, the Aussie game is professional, OK, but the GAA, including in Dublin, is amateur, OK? So it’s not that Dubs are looked after in a way that other GAA players aren’t, OK?
How is our defence not working as a unit?
Alan Brogan literally said during the week that Dublin work hard on palmed goals.
It needs serious work over the winter our defence.
Cons goals was 4 defenders v 2 attackers.
Cillian leaves Niall Scully, everyone then rushes to Niall Scully, no one tracks Con. Very poor for this level.
For the first goal once McCarthy broke clear everyone should be thinking palmed goal, force a poor goalscoreer to shoot after sprinting 70 yards with Aidan right on him to pressure him.
Horan sayd in build up that they don’t like to overload the lads with information. That’s sensible. But I mean Dublin were literally turning down points v Cavan to practice for palmed goals in the semi final.
There’s coaches from other sports with no knowledge of GAA would not miss that and seek counsel on how to limit.
JP – there may be something in that but you can’t ignore the fact Carr is constantly picking up injuries. If you look since the restart, Mullin, McLaughlin and Conroy started all 7 matches while Ryan O’Donoghue started the 5 in championship. The momentum and confidence that breeds in players is huge compared to Mark Moran who had 2 injuries in that time and James Carr too.
@Andy’s, I posted a Dublin player in the AFL earlier today, his name, his age, his club, his record setting speed.
@Wide ball, yes injuries have disrupted James Carr’s progress is true.
OK let’s stop giving Brolly the privilege of putting pen to paper. He said Mayo would get annilated by double digits and if he got it right he would have started his split into 2 Counties rant about the Dubs. He was wrong AGAIN, it’s not a coincidence he got the sack from RTE so he went back into his old rant about Mayo set up cos he has a mate in West Mayo, who is a gentleman for the record. I am not sure who is the bigger fool, him or Sean Óg who insulted Antrim on the day they qualifed for top tier in hurling and enough said. He was fortunate to play in one All Ireland Final when the standard was at a much lower level than today and if he was playing today he’d be lucky to get on the subs bench of any Division 2 team with his physique. A bit sad he has to insult our players who played in 5 All Ireland Finals who just happened to come up against a great bunch of footballers from the greatest team of all time. Respect to the Dubs awsome. Well done Mayo, stopped the Joe Brolly’s of this world having an argument of trying to undermine the GAA by making an excuse of money ETC to split Dublin in 2. Kerry, Tyrone, Galway, Donegal and maybe even Mayo will put the shoulder to the wheel again next year to try and stop the rot and stop these bigots trying to find faults in the beautiful game. Mayo Abu
“Cillian O’Connor, Ryan O’Donoghue and Oisin Mullin ran Mayo’s attack in the first half with 40 possessions between them. Dublin’s changes took all three completely out of the game after half-time. O’Donoghue touched the ball just twice in the 2nd half ” (cahair o kane Irish news )
https://www.irishnews.com/sport/gaafootball/2020/12/21/news/dubs-zone-in-on-mayo-trio-to-turn-the-tide-2166226/
Did our MOM & Their MOM not mark each other????
https://extra.ie/2020/12/20/sport/gaa/mayo-dublin-refereeing?fbclid=IwAR2nmZQZrJVOpUhcBivCm08XeXNHxVmetxgP2vwNxloUrFdHink88HloTf4
Interesting perspective
Ref had 2 big calls to make and he missed them both. Both advantaged Dublin-not to say it made THE difference between winning and losing, but it definitely made a difference in the final outcome
Ah stop the nonsense the best team won
We have the shortest day of the year coming after what felt like the longest day of the year yesterday in some respects. No question Oisin was the nailed on Man of the Match and hopefully we will see many more great performances from him.
Pundits know where the money is and they won’t bite the hand that feeds them. Brolly is just an asshole and all I read was the introduction to his hideous opinion piece. As a footballer he knows what it takes to play the game and he got luck and won a celtic cross for a county now wandering in the wilderness. His attacks on AOS are beyond comprehension and his depiction of their being a celebrity culture around the Mayo team is laughable. The number of times AOS has taken that Mayo team on his back and carried it over the finishing line in games is fully appreciated by us supporters. I have reached a point where I don’t really care what anyone outside the county says about Mayo anymore with the exception of our friends who post constructively on this blog.
I have been following Mayo since the 60s and a time when we were also unofficially the second best team in the country behind our near neighbors Galway. I have seen bad times and even worse times but nothing compares to the enjoyment of the last 10 years. I would rather be losing AIs than not even getting in one any year. It has reached a stage where Dublin winning an AI is almost meaningless and on the opposite side of that our losing another is also meaningless. Whats another year!
An observation regarding this description of how humble this group of Dubs are:
they know better than anyone how much the odds are stacked in their favour financially numerically and logistically. They know it’s unfair and are not immune to a little bit of a guilty feeling. Sweeping out the dressing room is laughable and then sending the video to the Saturday game is laughable. I don’t buy it for one second. More propaganda from the Dublin GAA Public Relations machine. When Mayo win I will personally sweep out both dressing rooms!
New league format looks interesting and we should be able to make the final if we approach it properly. Only issue is will Horan give 4 or 5 newbies a go and risk losing a game or two and getting stuck in Division 2 for another year. I expect 4 or 5 retirements so he probably won’t have a choice. It’s going to be fast and furious next year and unlikely spectators will see any live action. Bring it on.
The sweeping of the dressing room and all that type of palaver is based on something to do with how the all blacks conduct themselves, I find it all stomach turning tbh within the context of the ethos of our games . It’s supposed to be amateur and a bit of ordinary about it . I dont know about anyone else but it’s all b ecoming a little less appealing as a supporter . Its going to take a trojan effort for anyone to knock them off their perch and even when it does happen I dont believe it will end Dublins dominance . Perhaps county football is dying a slow death we just dont realise it .
Bogman, point well made above and I agree with you. Personally, I have no issue with competitively contested AIFs we lose….none at all. That is, always believing that the big win will arrive. However, my big fear is Mayo not getting to AIFs or a long run of years out of the top tier – now that would be a horrible experience, given the enjoyment we’ve had for past 3 decades with our team regularly featuring in the final decider.
Bogman, your point well made above and I agree with you. Personally, I have no issue with competitively contested AIFs we lose….none at all. That is, always believing that the big win will arrive. However, my big fear is Mayo not getting to AIFs or a long run of years out of the top tier – now that would be a horrible experience, given the enjoyment we’ve had for past 3 decades with our team regularly featuring in the final decider.
No county should kick another ball until every registered player in the country receives the same funding.
The 31 other counties are foolish if they do not band together and inform the Gaa that they will not be taking part in either next year’s league or championship unless the financial imbalances are put right.
Let the Dubs be awarded Sam Maguire by default. That would be the 7th time in succession it has happened.
A few things. We need to stop blaming refs every time we lose. I agree Coldrick possibly got some wrong. Hit on Keegan equals yellow plus free in. Remember Cunniffes hit on Harte in 2013 had us all purring but Mickey thought it was illegal. Cooper black card for pull down on AIdo. No black card for McDaid. A couple of late tackles by Mayo lads could have resulted in cards of some colour.Hindsight is marvellous. We should have brought on Keith in forwards!!! Just imagine if we brought on Keith and left Carr and Coen on the bench. There would be some eye rolling done. I perfectly understand bring on Carr and Coen. Coen was probably told to kick for scores and in fairness contributed our only point from play in second half but took some bad options. Carr did little other than one hit and hope kick that was gathered by Cluxton. Ryan o Donaghue was very game and willing and carried the fight to Dublin as well as scoring two good points. He was also dispossessed easily and was non existent in the second half. It just didn’t happen for Tommy Conroy or Eoin McLaughlin but they have both had great years. Oisin is a fantastic prospect and was outstanding in the first 20 minutes but if we are really honest with ourselves he contributed little after that while marking the best player on the pitch.Those young lads will learn and all have been very impressive. Some of the elder statesmen were brilliant Clarke excellent throughout. Leeroys best game all season. Cillian a super first half though Dubs kept him quieter in second half, Diarmaid such an honest contribution. You absolutely could not fault our players. They gave it absolutely everything and made Dublin look beatable. We just don’t have the strength in depth to beat them. Our team deserves huge credit for the efforts made and the joy they brought to us all in this difficult year. It will be a shame if we don’t see some of those great warriors again but fair play to Keith for putting St Philly in his place at half time. One final point and I know I shouldn’t even mention Brollix. But what a sad little prat he is Claiming Mayo lost because of our celebrity culture. The only person seeking celebrity status is him and any Mayo club or organisation inviting that fella down to club do s etc should cop on. The only reason I would like to see him is to tell him exactly what I think of him. He is not fit to lace the boots of those he criticises. Maigh Eo Abu.
Think it’s way too far down the road for protest. Imo it needs an independent inquiry, a professional and transparent one . It’s all such a mess and the faux debate on rte with mcentee and gilroy epitomised that , no research with proper facts and figures , along with context of how funding into underage coaches or schools is how it eventually benefited the senior county set up. Not a blah blah argument with ewan McKenna throwing out a graph and then that rubbished by pro Dublin enthusiasts. Show it to us mere mortals ,show me how con o callaghan went from scrawny to a bull in a couple of years , yet over several years the same couldn’t be achieved with several of our bucks evan Regan et el .
Something does not add up how everyone of them are machines, they never tire and are relentless in the final phase of a game . The team that beats Dublin will have to be 5/6 points up going into 65th minute of a game .
@Sean Burke, Imagine our team togging 5 Oisins yesterday. That’s the power of population and genetic outliers. You could make Oisin a gymnast, a weightlifter, a crossfit champion, a top soccer player, a basketballer, a 400metre runner. A county like Mayo just will have less Oisins and Con OCallaghans these genetic rarities than Dublin. We are however blessed with height. There is some quirk of long term genetics that six foot or above and athletic is pretty common in Mayo. It’s why we’ve always usually had an abundance of midfielders.
Anecdotally when you would see the Mayo crowds outside Croker you can look around Quinns and well above six foot you have any amount of selection.
JP,
As far as this year’s All Ireland is concerned James Madden would not have been next or near it. With their population/player choice Dublin do not need to bring youngsters like him into their senior panel. This year Bugler at 22 was their youngest player while Mayo had four at 22 or younger. Next was Murchan [and maybe O’Callaghan] at 24. That Madden is the only name you could come up with just proves my point. How many more Maddens of his age are there in Dublin?
After watching back the game one moment stuck with me. 74 minutes gone Dublin 5 points up and the game won. Kevin McLoughlin gets bottled up and a free out is given. Paul Mannion turns and roars into his face. Imagine that’s the reaction when about to win an All Ireland?! Kevin is probably the quietest most unassuming intercounty player in the country as well.
But these Dublin players are humble apparently!
@Wideball.
Don’t know if you saw the comment or not,
but someone commented on here after the game that everytime the ball went next or near to Tommy Conroy, the Dublin contingent in Croke Park booed and jeered him.
They said they could clearly hear it because of the empty Croke Park.
Re Kevin Mcstay and his referee worshipping. Do I not remember him serving a ban for throwing a ball at a referee ?
Maybe his non partisan or partisan should I say opinions on refereeing decisions are part of his penance for the disdain he once showed himself, for the holy man in the middle (or muddle).
I’ve always enjoyed Mcstays analysis but for the life of me I cannot see why the hell he cannot call the game as it actually happened.
Past encounters on the Sunday game have been exactly the same. The hand trips and uppercuts and neck swinging and wrestling mayo players to the ground were never dealt with.
Yet a GPS made national headlines.
There is more raw sewage running through the Rte Pipeline than runs in to Dublin bay. Actually it runs indirectly from Rte through our sitting rooms and off in to the bay. And we only have to pay 180 euros a year to keep it flowing. A smelly bargain if you ask me.
Not only have we to pay 180 euros for our games (that were sold to sky), but because Rte pays some of its main clowns more money than a Columbian cartel lord earns in a good year for cocaine, we are also privileged to have a hefty lump of our taxes go to keep the Rte Dublin Rah Rah channel afloat each year.
And now we learn that in these times of high unemployment, the Dublin team are after screwing some poor soul out of a job by cleaning up their own dressing room.
The Dublin humble Pies should be on sale this side of Christmas. There is a row of 6 in each packet. Some lucky packets will be stuffed with cash (in Dublin). Lesser sums of cash might be found in packets purchased in other Counties. There will be 7 pies in next year’s packets.
Let’s buy some Dublin humble Pies this Christmas and remind ourselves just how fucken arrogant the rest of us all are.
I always have this same thought after every single final we have played against the Dubs.
Campaigned I’m
There used to be a saying in IT that nobody ever gets fired for purchasing IBM. Well no ref ever gets dropped from the roster for giving a 40/60 or even a 30/70 decision to the Dubs.
This phenonemon is not restricted to Dubs v Mayo, nor is it restricted to Gaelic sports. But getting back to the Dubs v Mayo aspect of this:
The result is that
1. Every Mayo played knows this and
2. Every Dub player knows this … and
3. Every ref knows this.
4. The Psychology of the games between Mayo an Dublin are played out on this basis.
So Mayo players know they will give away a kickable free, get a black card, or get a red card far far easier than a Dub will. This is a phenonemon that can be borne out by a mountainous number of examples backing it up
So to say that the Dubs are cynical, or play “on the edge” and that Mayo do not, is absolutely true. It is true because the Dubs know they can and the Mayo players know they cannot, or they will suffer to the detriment of their team. These may be subconscious thoughts, but are real.
So not only do Mayo have to “back off” from the cynical stuff, the Dubs can pretty much do it with abandon.
Take last Sunday,
1. I saw Mayo players backing off possible black card offences on a number of occasions.
2. The Dubs committed them with on much more than one occasion. The eventual black card that Dublin received was a cumulative effect of a number of black card offences committed by Dublin.
3. All podcast pundits are unanimous in their agreement that the foul on Lee Keegan was a red card. Maybe a charitable black card. Why no consultation
4. Jonny Cooper had to go for a black card. Maybe the ref reasoned he could not have 2 Dubs off the pitch at the same time.
So those 4 items, above, are 4 direct effects of the phenonemon i refer to. But the indirect effects are the real killers … all Mayo players knowing they have to watch their behaviour, whereas the Dubs can play on the edge knowing the rules are applied to them with the same stringency. This has to have cost Mayo 5 points minimum on Saturday. This is reality.
AND THAT DOES NOT COUNT THE ACTUAL INCIDENTS.
The black card Cooper should have been given …. Let’s say 2 points additional for Mayo during that 10 minutes.
The red card. Say 5 additional points to Mayo for the rest of the match.
That puts Mayo winning the match by 7 points.
And that does not count the pdychological effects outlined above
I might be dreaming. But tell me where I’m wrong
I can hear the questions was to why is there favouritism towards the Dubs.
Well Dublin Garlic Football is rated as the prodigal son, the fatted calf, the golden grail, the money machine, the means to riches, the financial sustenance, the piggy banks, of the GAA. Whether the above are true or not, that is what is believed in the corridors of power. That is what a referee must bear in mind:
Rule number 1: Don’t kill the fatted calf
Rule number 2: Don’t let Mayo kill off the fatted calf
Rule 4: Dublin needs at 10 times per capita more spent on players
Rule 5: ignore other populous GAA wastelands, such as Limerick City. (60% soccer, 30 % rugby and 10% GAA) that now should share in that booty.
Apart from all of this ,
1. Mayo missed Brendan. Harrison like never before.
2 we also missed Fionn McDonagh, and Mark Moran
3. Let’s call a spade a spade, we were missing Paddy Durkan pretty much from the start.
4.. Keith Higgins should have been brought in to replace him after 10 minutes, and Keegan
broughtt out to half back.
If they were all in place, 2 point each for 1 to 3. Number 4 was our only fault
With nothing else changing , then my guesstimate is that Mayo would have won handily
The only thing we can do is to start a campaign. Maybe a documentary, on bias towards Dublin. It might just plant s seed of doubt in referrees mindsets … Sandy just might make the difference
*it just might make the difference
Agree totally claremorris 1951!
Just on the goals Dublin score with handy tap ins.
When the last defender commits to the man coming with the ball and leaves his man for the handy tap in goal. Should the goalie go to the last forward straight away and play as a defender, while the remaining original defender goes hell bent on stopping the shot? Because he cannot pass the ball into the net and the last forward is covered by the goalie! I know it might end with a goal but they always get them handy ones. Just might work or at least make them take a shot.
Sean Burke agree re Dubs. Killing the game. Lots of Dubs don’t enjoy watching them either. They just run teams into the ground and their stamina and strength is miles ahead of everyone else. I do think it is fair to ask why?
@justoutsideballagh, they’re ahead of everyone through a mixture of advanced preparation and backroom support, natural athletes, elite footballers on skill side, massive backroom research into how to manage games and their energy levels plus having a strong bench.
Is it catchable? On some occasions. But now that the taxpayer is footing the yearly GAA revenue top up it should be government who step in and more force the GAA to more fairly allocate resources.
The previous GAA money guy Tom Ryan said Dublin are a net contributor. But the main earner is the semi finals and final. I’d argue it’s the event itself is the contributor but it won’t be for long if semi final attendances collapse and there isn’t the interest to increase ticket prices for the final.
@Claremorris1951, all pie in the sky stuff really. The simple fact is that Mayo did well in the first half, Dublin analysed this at half time and came out and shut down our influential players. I read stats that they limited Ryan 0 Donohoe to just 2 touches in the 2nd half after him playing very well in the first. We had an extra man for the first 10 mins of the 2nd half and made no headway whatsoever. Dublin controlled the game with ease. We were 2 points up, they go up the field and get an easy goal. And as soon as they go 4 or 5 points up in the 2nd half, it was game over, they know how to see a game out and can play keep ball for long periods if they choose. Extremely frustrating on a tiring team but very effective. Dublin are on a different level. We gave them a good rattle and should be proud of the lads effort. But the result was never in doubt.
Good article by Kieran Shannon in the examiner today (perhaps to make up for the trash they published on Saturday). State’s that James Horan needs to get aido scoring again, and I’d agree. His days at midfield are over, he doesn’t have the mobility for it anymore. Hes needs to be left at 14 and somehow to discover his scoring form because it’s evident in the last few years his confidence to shoot is gone. I think when he gets a free close to goal he should pop it over himself and not wait for cilian, just to get used to it again. Shannon also points out to beat the dubs by 3 you need to be 6 points better than them because of the favourable refereeing decisions they get, you can sing that one! I think going forward there’ll be 1 or 2 all Ireland’s up for grabs each decade when the dubs under perform. I don’t think there’s any appetite in the gaa to tackle Dublin issue so don’t expect any change. The Leinster championship really is dead and I don’t know how attendances are going to hold up.perhaps the heirachy have assessed the income coming in from the Dublin supporters and don’t requires any paying fans from other counties. I find it hard to believe they havnt looked at this in detail. Finally I have to say that any mayo club or organization that invites that a$$ brolley to any of their events should be ashamed of themselves. It’s hard to believe that this goes on. I don’t like giving him air but it has to be said.
Agree with Dave J. The Dubs controlled the second half and kept us at bay comfortably. They could have pushed on and beat us by 10 points if they wanted. When we went 2 points up in first half – Dubs sensed a bit of danger and went down field to score a goal straight away.
Having said that it was a good experience for the younger players and we gave a good account of ourselves. As James Horan said afterwards we did a lot of things right.
Great credit to David Ckarke on the kick outs.
I’m sorry but that’s just not true that they could of pushed on and beat us by ten points , they dont choose not to beat Kerry or our lads by a less margin than Meath or laois etc , its because we are better they can’t. We missed plenty to make it even closer , our decision making became poor as we tired , kicking into the keepers hands is unforgivable stuff . A Dublin player sprayed a ball across field , a complete mess of a thing , how darren Coen misjudged it for a fantastic turnover opportunity is again very poor.
Overall we have plenty to work on , we need more though, we need more accurate shooters from play at least one more . If mullen sticks with it for 21 we have to slot him into midfield . Personally I’d love to see eoin o Donoghue back into the team along with the ballagh lad mcbrien , that allows you to bring Mullen up . Keegan has still lots left to give but back to his natural hb role , Durcan to fit into the attack in a new role . Aido to the bench for a vital impact sub role .
Theory on Fenton. He is only effective when the Mayo players starts to tire.
He has never played well against us in the 1st half of any match when
the Mayo intensity levels are high and he is being tightly marked.
He has tremendous stamina, that even Diarmuid could not match.
Same against Kerry last year, only played well when opposition got tired.
Bring a fresh sub on at half time to mark him, might be the answer.
Same kinda applies to Kilkenny. Con O’C is a different animal though,
Greatest midfielder of all time ? don’t think so.
The fittest midfielder of all time, alright.
I said here before the match that Keith Higgins should be utilised in the second half. No disrespect to the bench, but when you looked at our subs to come on the last day, no player there had the quality of Keith Higgins. Its easy in hindsight and its totally understandable that James is trusting in the youth. But I can’t help feel that he missed a trick. Keith has the quality of many of the players on the Dublin team in terms of athleticism and pace, regardless of age. And by the evidence of the half-time tunnel scene, he wasn’t half fired up!! He was the man to bring in.
Keith NEVER underperformed in an All Ireland final. Same with Leeroy who struggled all year for form. You just knew Lee would have a super final which he did. Only for getting illegally smashed by Fitzsimons Lee could have created a goal in that move, or could have created a goal afterwards (the smash undoubtedly affected him negatively from then on).
I know Keith looked nervy coming on against Galway but I’d have put my house on him to have a very positive 20-25 mins last Saturday. You just can’t ignore quality like that. And stats (GPS etc), player-form, etc leading up to a final should be disregarded when decisions need to be made in the third quarter of an All Ireland. You go with quality, players that have proven themselves. No disrespect to the younger lads, but James should have taken into account the fact that some of the newer lads struggled. Moreover, there was the flexibility to replace one of our forwards with Keith. There was only a point in the game at 50mins or so so we weren’t chasing the game. By god was it there for tge taking. Dubs are only human, and we could have rattled them.
Not bringing him in was probably our biggest error on Saturday. It was a grave mistake from James. Given the season is starting in 6 weeks, and All Ireland final is in July, James should encourage Keith and a couple others to remain. Naturally you couldn’t blame them if they left. But its just having that option to introduce a high quality player at a key time.
I watched the game last night with no commentary.
Here are the facts from an experienced football head.
Mayo should have 13 points on the board at half time.
Paddy Durcan may have been injured going into the game.
The assault on Lee Keegan was terrible, no question but a straight red. Coldrick had a very close up view, 10 yards away. Lee battled on after this was was again grabbed around the head by Cooper.
The hold back or pull down on Aidan was a black card, no question, although there may have been a slight dive to get further forward.
Can all of ye just look at this in the replay,
the look on Fitzsimmons face to his Captain Cluxton was one of oh shit I’m gone.
The look on Kieran McDonalds face was what I was thinking at the time, Mayo were not going to get fair play from the referee.
Look at Coldrick’s face when Lee was taken out, it was one of a guy that appeared to be stressed because he knew he could not things by the rulebook.
Mayo were too marshalled and didnt make any errors in mistimed tackles so one cannot say if the referee would let their rough tackling go, Fenton didnt get a wallop from O Connor yet went down as if he got killed, see O Gara’s tweet re comparison to Neymars diving.
The game was there to be won on the day, the assault on Lee took place on 46 minutes when Mayo were 1 point behind.
“Cillian O’Connor, Ryan O’Donoghue and Oisin Mullin ran Mayo’s attack in the first half with 40 possessions between them. Dublin’s changes took all three completely out of the game after half-time. O’Donoghue touched the ball just twice in the 2nd half ” (cahair o kane Irish news )
That stat alone proves the point that Dublin’s depth of talent on the bench is just something we can’t live with. Dublin can bring on players just as good and even better…we don’t have that.
That’s one way of looking at it yew tree or Dublin identify through real time with their million men stats team where they are getting roasted , then devise a plan for the second half with the comfort of still being two points ahead , first thing they do before the second half even starts , get a hold of that cillian lad philly in the tunnel.
I’m not saying they’re wrong to do whatever , its smart , efficient and effective but we need to start learning how to out smart . It’s no longer about just been street smart as they say ,its being laptop smart , bluff and double bluff , leave some eggs in your basket for that last quarter. Mullen up front , keegan to the middle etc etc I’m just randomly making stuff here , my point is you have to have lots left in your locker for the last quarter against Dublin, I’m convinced it’s the only way .
I have to agree with yew tree. Dubs have impact subs who can change a game. Our substitutions resulted in disjointness of the team if anything.
We have to accept team in transition and Horan is going to have to be ruthless in his decision making ré the panel of players going forward.
I think its an advantage we are in second div of league. An opportunity to give experienced players who stay around a good rest. And experiment with the abundant talent we have coming up.
Congrats to Oisín. A midfielder in the making?
Great article by Kieran Shannon. The only pundit with the guts to call out Dublins “privilege” with referees. Strong words but true. I hope, as he does, that we can bounce back after this. He doesn’t see the loss as being as bad as other ones. I’m not so sure myself.. time will tell…
One things for sure. We need our older veterans coming on as subs, the “cavalry” as he rightly says. This doesn’t mean that our best team doesn’t start. The older lads are too old/have too many miles on the clock now to start. James still must persist with starting the younger lads who’ve earned their places. They’ll continue to improve.
Niallmc regarding this “The Leinster championship really is dead and I don’t know how attendances are going to hold up.perhaps the heirachy have assessed the income coming in from the Dublin supporters and don’t requires any paying fans from other counties.”
Tom Ryan was on the GAA hour, when your exact question was put to him he was totally lost. He actually admitted that a far too strong Dublin undermining attendances was not something they had considered.
He dwelt a while on that other counties need to remember that Dublin are a net contributor.
That I don’t agree with. The All Ireland finals and semis generate a huge chunk of the revenue. They do so regardless of which teams are contesting.
We know a match in Croke Park breaks even on a crowd of 33k.
So on what basis are Dublin some cash cow for the GAA?
Their fans buying semi final and final tickets was no different than Mayo Donegal in 2012, or Kerry Donegal 2014.
Stop the second goal (which we could have if anyone tracked O’Callaghan run). Get the 2 obvious frees (O’Shea/Keegan). That’s us ul 2 or 3 points at half time. Could Dublin have played keep ball then? Would decision to out sweeper on have been genius stroke?
Point is the result was much closer than it looks. Fine, fine margins still. With multiple debutants and more coming through. I am very optimistic for 2021 and beyond…
Despite all the Dubs advantages we will continue to get under their skin.
Wherever we go. Up Mayo
Next year I’d love to see a young pacey, all out and out defenders full backline combined with a Goalie comfortable with ball in hand.
Colm Reape and Luke Jennings goalkeepers.
Jackie Coyne
David McBrien
Eoin ODonoghue
Just a lot of work on not conceding goals but also playing keep ball when we want to rest our attack in a half.
I don’t know about anyone else but I am still really struggling to understand why, with Dublin down to 14 men, Horan chose to deploy an extra defender. I know we had lost Paddy (who had struggled for a huge portion of the first half) but it felt like a decision that was made with very little planning, although I could of course be mistaken. As defensive strategies go, it felt disjointed and reactionary.
This piece by Aidan O’Rourke is an interesting read:
https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2020/1222/1185918-numbers-game-means-dublin-dominance-inevitable/
I remember when Dublin were playing Meath remarking to a friend on how consistently intense (and terrifying) Dublin were, not in attack, but in defence. They are the best defensive team out there.
So in short we can’t score, we can’t defend and we have no bench. And we still managed to hang in there for most of the game!
Seán Burke, totally agree with your post, I said it earlier but was slapped as anti AOS which I’m not, someone pointed out that he is not mobile enough in midfield and JH need to get him scoring again.
I’m sorry but with exception of Donegal game I don’t ever remember him scoring much as he is not a natural forward.
Impact sub either mf or cf to win ball, we need total attackers if this is the style we are going to play
Also as I’ve said before he is been asked to do much, needs a defined role
Up for the match – Aido scored 3-4 vs Sligo in the Connacht Final of 2015. He’s not a prolific scorer, never really has been, but I think too many people just look at his limited scoring and write him off.
Certainly the Dubs management don’t write him off given he’s nearly always double marked. If he was shite, they wouldn’t be bothering with that.
He’s on the team on merit because he’s one of the best tacklers in the game and also a great passer. If he were smaller, he’d probably get more frees than he does given the tackles he has to face from opponents.
I would agree though he’s being asked to do too much and gets dragged from pillar to post as a result.
All, just a few things:
1. Have a look at the main banner photo on our MayoGAABlog site – from start of League Final 2019. I’m sure you’ll be shocked to see just how few of the starters that day started or featured at all last Sat. I was a bit gobsmacked. Surely we’re not as bad as we thought therefore.
2. Aido at no. 14 – that is the key that would unlock everything for us last Sat IF we had a strong, tall, reliable player to go beside Mattie at MF. We needed extra support there. (For what it’s worth I think Jordan Flynn can grow into a good option for us there. He is a safe pair of hands once he matures). Aido at no. 14 could have got scores coming and also put the Dubs on the back foot. That means points accumulating while also Dublin need to pull their attention back the field. Double benefit.
3. Prevent the early Dublin goal.
(4. Put an early goal or two on the board ourselves and have the Dubs chase us.
5. I notice the Dubs rarely fumbled or lost the ball in hand. This was frustrating to watch as we couldn’t get the ball that way. Interesting to note).
I can’t be overly critical of Horan with deploying a sweeper . I think after last years semi I think he has many sleepless night of what the Dubs done to us in a ten min blitz . I’d say Horan thought if we can keep it tight coming into the last 10 mins he was going to back the lads to eek out a lead . Wasn’t to be and it’s easy to be critical of that decision but Horan got a more right than wrong in the game .
Dublin are the most clinical team I have seen . We can talk about the money and population but this is what has transpired onto the pitch a ruthless clinical team .
I’m not sure what the answer is . I don’t like getting involved in these debates as it can be throwing in my face that it is sour grapes . But I will say that dominance is not good for any sport .
It’s a system and a rigid game plan which is going to take this Dublin team out, a game plan constructed specifically for when we face Dublin. We tend to get completely distracted by talk of refereeing decisions, financial and other advantages including population. We need to forget about these things and concentrate completely on developing the system. We should also not get carried away by constantly looking for new players who might make a difference. Once the system is developed it’s the best players who fit into the system who are used.
I don’t want to make it sound like it’s something that can be done easily but I do have first hand knowledge of it in another sport. There are countless examples of this in soccer for instance. It takes extreme dedication and discipline but it is possible believe me and I think there are the players in Mayo who can carry it out.
The first thing that jumps out at me is a simple tweak that could be made in the half forward line to increase the conversion rate. In my opinion, we are getting it all wrong when it comes to substitutions and this is because we have not developed a way to defeat Dublin. And the way is the “system” I have in mind, for example no forward substitutions would be made unless an injury occurs.
I’m going to write a thesis about this and see how far it’s taken by Mayo GAA. I wouldn’t be one bit concerned about how much money or population Dublin have, I couldn’t care less about them in fact, they’ve been mollycoddled all their lives, take 95% of their population and money away and send them to the emigration ravaged western seaboard, I doubt then they would even contest an All-Ireland, never mind win one.
I don’t understand the hate mayo player’s and people are getting from donegal people it’s a joke can’t understand why or were it’s coming from things said to me to day ireland will have a united ireland before mayo also mayo should be cursed that they never get to a all Ireland again I youst to dislike Tyrone but I got it wrong it’s now donegal I hope they never get out of ulster again
Diehard
Don’t take it to heart. Mayo have knocked Donegal out 3 times since they won in 2012 and it’s a sore point for some in the county. They may have a point about untied Ireland though, which is proof at least that all empires fall in the end.
Read Aidan O’Rourkes article and I’d have to say he is dead right as he usually is. Mayo have some great defenders, Keegan and Durcan are two of the best man markers around, Coen does a good job, Barrett is a really strong defender but we haven’t a clue how to defend as a team, and ORourke is right is saying it’s not in Mayos culture to defend. How many times on here have people suggested, Keegan, Durcan, Higgins now Mullin, McLaughlan play in Midfield of Forwards? Does Mayo care enough about defending? The days of man on man are gone, a full team strategy is now required to close down space when without the ball, is Horan capable of implementing such a system, from the evidence so far I’d have to say no. Therefore someone needs to be brought on board who can organise a proper defence to complement the offensive part of our game.
I dont think its outlandish to suggest Mullen to midfield at all, is it not a case of weighing up where a player is more useful , you’re not robbing the greatest defender of all time to shore up midfield cause your short there , you’re utilising his greatest attributes as a footballer imo . In modern football terms he could be the best again just my opinion . In a proper defensive unit slash gameplan we wouldn’t have to rely on defenders making a burst , I really hope Horan looks at tweaking his philosophy on the gameplan , he wouldn’t have to change a whole lot ya know to win an all Ireland again imo . But shur isn’t that why we post here to discuss out opinions
I feel a lot better today, thanks. I expect to make a full recovery.
Posters going on a lot about Kieran Shannon’s Examiner article:https://www.irishexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/arid-40195107.html
It’s linked to above.
Agree with nearly every word of it. Yes, Horan right to go with newbies for first 15, but the Keith’s and Tom’s and Boylers must be the ones to call on to make an impact with 20 minutes to go. We could and should do this in every game; it had become a non-option on Saturday because it hadn’t been utilised, with the exception of the Galway game. I know Keith was iffy that day, but he hadn’t played competitively all or most of the year.
As for Aido scoring more, sure; work on that.
Also there are probably a few more newbies to try. Don’t know a lot about Jack Coyne, but he was making the match-day 26 for a lot of games. He’s a corner back (was at u20), so that could be useful, and presumably he’s fleet-footed, but perhaps posters could enlighten me.
Also, McBrien looks ok in Tuam, Mark Moran and Paul Towey will be a year further on in the S&C stakes.
But we’ve got to become an 80 minute team, either burying opposition in the last quarter or just playing it out, but in total control. We didn’t achieve that in any game this year; even Tyrone when we were laying siege to them, I felt they were reasonably comfortable.
Isn’t it fantastic to see that Penal times are alive and well in old Eire.
Lord Dublin looks across his vast domain at the tiny holdings, watching the little farmers putting their little potatoes in to their little buckets. A years hard labour is required to satisfy the great Lord. ” The little farmers have never had it as good ” quips Lord Dublin as he tears away another mouthful of deer meat from the leg with his powerful Jaws.
Let it not be said that Lord Dublin isn’t a fair Lord. Annually, he drags the tenants from one of his lets, before him. In his specially constructed Coliseum he will allow them to do battle with his hungry lions. The barely presentable tenants, if they survive the barbaric treatment, are kindly allowed to amble back to their holdings.
In jubilant mood after watching the days entertainment Lord Dublin is entertained by his court Jesters.
His favorite court Jester is Jelly Jowls. Jelly Jowls knows where Lords Dublins toes are and is always careful not to tread on them. He would be cast outside the castle walls and maybe worse if he annoyed his Lord.
And while the little farmers return to their little wives in their little lean to, Lord Dublin and Jelly Jowls drink tankards of meade and goblets of wine and plan for next years outing for their tenants.
Its great to see how far our country has come in a matter of only a couple of hundred years.
Lol, great writing revelhino.
You know in the end, the peasants get tired of the lords and it never ends well.
@Revellino, as somebody that is self Employed the Gaa remind me of the Public Services in Ireland, they are an Institution, go with the populist, jobs for the boys type of thing, dont change for sake of giving others the opportunity to do a better job.
I agree with alot of what you say it seems to me that the Gaa like to bring Mayo along for the ride, they are great supporters but we cannot let ye win.
Sure if Mayo were to win then Croker would have us Culchies to fill the seats, other County supporters dont travel in the same large numbers.
The famine is still evident for us supporters but we can only hope for that day to come where this will end, we will always be there, to see if we win on the big day that’s the way it is.
Or as Gaeilge “thiocfaidh ar lar”
FBD, agree he is a fine player, just not sure how to use him best, Mortimer was a good forward but Horan dropped him as he didn’t fit into running game and I think Horan was bang on with that one.
Reading that article that was posted earlier fills me with hope for next couple of years
A few players that could be added to the panel in the New year, and in my mind were better than the subs Horan brought on the last day. We also badly need a replacement keeper either Jennings or McNicholas needs to be brought in. If I was Horan I would flood the team with youth in the 3 games against Down, Meath and Westmeath in the League and leave all experienced players rest for the championship.
Enda Hession Garrymore
Frank Irwin Ballina
Conor Diskin Claremorris
Cian Hanley Ballagh
Peter Naughton Knockmore
Kieran King Knockmore
Aidan Orme Knockmore
Connell Dempsey Knockmore
Sharoize Akram Ballagh
Luke Jennings Ballinrobe
Jamie McNicholas Kiltimagh
We have to get back to Division one football in my view this is key to our development. It was a major step backwards getting relegated and is now a disadvantage in developing players for July.
Tyrone winning that day was a major setback
@Revellino . I think that I know who Jelly Jowls is, (Enabler in Chief)..mind you there is a whole cast of enablers, some of whom have taken up residence in the Court of Jelly Jowls…. What the peasants need is a good dose of amnesia… Michéal Martin’ tried it last week in the Dáil when he said that the banks weren’t bailed out “It’s a fact” stated The delusional Taioseach, It didn’t go down well, but such myths work very well for the Dublin GAA enablers and go unchallenged by Jelly Jowls, Michéal might have well mused… But I nearly chocked on Sunday, after the Women’s All Ireland Final (as if Saturday wasn’t bad enough) when I heard one of the Dublin ladies after winning the “4 in a Row” about how they channelled “the hurt” of previous defeats… They are buying in this absolute ballony, a far cry from when they won their first one, back then they were just delighted and over the moon, it must be contagious, this manufactured narritive the equivalent of “Weapons of Mass destruction” myth as professed by George W Bush and Tony Blair.. In fairness to the Dublin Women, they play championship games in a range of different venues, and and don’t require their hands held quite as much as their male equivalents, but I worry for them as it seems contagious the manufactured narritive., A whole host of Dublin apologists have recently spoke about ‘their years of hurt’ it wouldn’t have been out of place in the recent RTE documentry about the Famine…. You know when members of the British Royal family go away for yet another war, for example on the pretext of ‘Weapons of Mass destruction’ they always come back with even more medals which they won fair and square, you can see them on their chests on those fantastic colourful uniforms, some of them have even more medals than Dublin players, and the war was always fair, and they always won… They are great at dodging bullet’s as well, none of them ever get shot, and they are so brave, incredible… Mind you one of them got a condition where he couldn’t sweat following his heroics in another just war, poor fella… Dublin are beginning to remind me of those people, and those who play the part of their Court Jester are no better!
Some mental comments. We only need look at our own mistakes and failings, identify and fix them.
The “unfairness” and “imbalance” has always been there. Central funding needs to be reformed but other than that I fail to see what can be done…and don’t talk about splitting or amalgamation.
There is a hell of a bigger gap between Mayo and Leitrim than there is between Dublin and Mayo. Counties like Kildare and Meath really need to look in the mirror, Wealthy counties with bigger populations than us who really should be doing a hell of a lot better.
If people want to go all out communist, pool all sponsorship money and put a cap on what counties can spend….but I think such a scenario could effect Mayo more than you think considering the amount of money we raise within the county and around the world.
Mayo v kerry final 2021
Brian Gavin in his article in the Examiner said that there appeared to be marks on Aidan’s face early in second half, and he wonders if the tunnel skirmish escalated inside. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this was the case. Would love to know more on this but it will probably be kept hush hush. Philly certainly appeared to be the instigator-in-chief from the clips we saw. Clearly it was Aidan and Cillian – our two best players – who he was targeting. Dublin are unreal, even their subs get in on the act, ie this and the sledging job of Tommy Conroy from the sideline.
TH, is peter Naughton not gone to Sligo? If so, it shouldn’t have happened. A big loss if true.
Pooling sponsorship money is different to pooling pooling funds raised by an individual county .
@Leantimes. You could be right about Jelly Jowls true identity.
Before he became Lord Dublin’s Jester in residence, they say he was rewarded in gold bits for dancing with the tzars.
A man of many talents (all of them hidden to this point), he was joined by a Dublin lady and a Cork lady on the Sunday game.
He started the chat by saying we’ll get to Cork in a minute before fawning about Dublin.
He then poked at and prodded at the Cork lady in a mocking way eeking out of her what made her unhappy about the way the match was refereed. Of course he always returned to ” Don’t Dublin deserve credit for that “.
Of course sometimes we are honoured to listen to Pat shillelagh Spillane.
A goldmine of football knowledge he’ll inform us in his high pitched non greased asscart axle screech ” Well I’ll tell yea something lads, football is a very simple game. You catch de ball and you kick de ball “.
Football has evolved over the past decade or two but I think the likes of Jelly Jowls and shillelagh must be waiting for it to come full circle before hopping on board again.
@Revellino, -Jelly Jowls, certainly done a bit of dancing in the recent past, in the Court of Lord Dublin, Dancing with the Tsars, .. I taught it might be a miss print at first, ‘Tsars’ and that you might have meant ‘Stars’ but that would be stretching it a bit..Yes Jelly Jowls seems to have great deference to the Nobility of Dublin and bows before their greatness..
Diehard
My brother has a business up there and he said the amount of customers who wanted to see Mayo beaten surprised him. When asked why they blamed the abuse given out to Donegal players, namely Murphy and the lack of hospitality given to them in hotels around Castlebar. We are better than that and have always in the past been respectful to other teams.
Abuse dished out to Michael Murphy?. Can’t say I’ve ever noticed that. How much hospitality were they expecting and didn’t get in hotels around Castlebar (which are few and far between these days anyway)?
lots of interesting comments there. Its been well discussed in my work in Dublin amoung the few of us there but some big GAA fans Dublin, Kerry and myself from Galway. Main agreed points yellow card Fitzsimons and black card Cooper. Mayo not getting enough from their forwards when it matters and has always been the case.why not push O Shea up and rain ball into him first 10 minutes 2nd half. The subs brought in just not same standard as say Dubs bringing on Howard. Point made for second goal Mayo defender didnt track back but stood beside his man that had gone down. Caught same as Kerry for goal. Belief Dublin had another gear but it wasnt needed. O Shea being badly used and caught for pace for goal from throw in.
Dubs confident of doing the 7 in a row!
Cheered me up lads believe Galway will win Connaught in 2021 but I wouldnt even put a fiver on that!
Kerry not developing and big problems in Defence and midfield, not sure what happened to Donegal and Leinster is a joke teams should stop spending on it and just select pick of teas from county final.
Cant see Dublin losing more than 2 of next 10 All Irelands.
We should pick the team of the West between Mayo and Galway I reckon we would beat them maybe instead of splitting Dubs counties should be combining. Say Westmeath, Offaly and Longford for example.
@Chesneychet, That’s exactly the point I was making, this stupid idea of other counties joining together, is to muddy the waters. It was first muted in a disgracfull insulting conversation between, the so called impartial moderator Des Cahill, Ex Dublin Manager and current Meath manager, Andy McEntee a few weeks ago on the Sunday Game, .. This conversation should not be forgotten by the rank and file of the GAA, it’s right up there with the GAA Director of Publicity, Alan Milton when he suggested that there might be voilence on the Streets of Newbridge, between Kildare and Mayo fan’s , if Mayo and Kildare were to meet in Newbridge or Nowhere’…The reason is designed to help you forget about the imbalance in financing from Central funding, and the prepetual Home advantage for Dublin, that’s the home advantage without the disadvantage of having to pay for it, they don’t even pay for the cutting of the grass..If anyone were to seriously consider that, Dublin would be considered the defacto owner of Croke Park now that the mortgage is paid on it, but it wasn’t paid for by Dublin… Don’t buy the Narritive, remember the way it was in the last century, Dublin don’t have the right to win the bulk of titles.. And they don’t have to be subsidized, it’s absolutely ballony..The second most populas County in Ireland is actually Antrim, ..Antrim has never won an All Ireland in hurling or football, I’m not sure even if they have won an Ulster title.. Now I know about half of the population there might not consider the GAA as their first port of call, even so.. Wouldn’t that be more reason for the GAA to subsidize Antrim, unless the GAA are partitionist… Trust me no such scheme was ever taught up as regards second biggest population Antrim and it’s second City on the Island, Belfast… It’s not just some of the racist chanting in Hill 16 thats thinks its Dublin only!
100% agree Leantimes. Croke Park is our national stadium. It should only be used for semi finals and finals. Maybe quarter finals if they’re played. No way should Dublin be allowed play every single game there. I don’t care what the other Leinster counties have conceded to. Provincial finals in other 3 provinces rotate venues depending on who are involved. We just had 2 consecutive Dublin Meath Leinster finals in Croke Park. Why was one of them not played in Meath? In fact why was either of them played in Croke Park? Why was the recent u20 final played there? Mayo pay upwards of half a million per year in financing for a new stand. And will for years to come. A stand that is just a basic facility for a county team and its supporters. Nothing extravagant. Dublin get Croke Park for free. It was paid for in the ’90’s by the Irish taxpayer. Was the vision at the time that it would be a home stadium for one team. I don’t remember that ever being said back then. Why did the dub fans on hill 16 lose their reason when Mayo warmed up on that end in 2006. Why indeed. Mayo had every right to choose that end. Why are dubs allowed play all their home league games there? Shouldn’t be allowed play any league game there except final if involved. Dub familiarity with Croke park is a significant advantage bestowed on their players. And all free gratis. Money can then be happily diverted to other grandiose projects like Spawell. 10 million I think? And another recent multi million project announced on north side. You couldn’t make it up. And they wheel out Pat Gilroy and Des Cahill on the national broadcaster RTE to tell us Kerry should amalgamate with Cork and Cavan join up with Monaghan. When will public start losing interest. Soon I’d say.
It’s a sad indictment that those things that are wrong with our games stem from the organisation itself.
There is no reason why funding for a registered player in Dublin should be 10 to 15 times higher than a registered player in another County.
Why ?
They’ll tell you for games development. Then in the next breath ” all the coaching is done by volunteers.
What about games development in Mayo. Where is our 274 per registered player or whatever the amount is ?
People on here often comment on the damage been done to the championship.
Leinster has been destroyed already. It’s not a competition anymore.
I believe the Super 8’s were set up as a wallpaper. Without the Super 8’s no other Leinster team other than Dublin would come out of Leinster. The super 8’s were invented to allow Dublin and all the dirty going ons to continue. Too many questions if no other team could come out of Leinster.
And yes. That so called discussion on the Sunday game was just a thick necked ex Dub manager, specifically put there to talk waffle.
Dr David Hickey or ” Dick ” as I like to call him wrote an insulting and totally arrogant article just before the final. He didn’t rate Mayo, called us a tragic outfit and said the Dubs toughest games were against their B team. He then went on to say how humble the Dublin team are. How would he know ? It was probably the most arrogant up your hole article I have ever read. Imagine a doctor coming out with that crap. Mind you the ex manager on the Sunday game did not come across much better.
How more can you insult every other team than by coming out and saying you win more because you train harder. That’s rubbish.
Well good luck to Dublin as they continue to build a monument to themselves with the full backing of central funding. Anybody that knows their arse from their elbow will never worship at this monument as it’s been built with arrogance and lies and fully backed by an organisation that is destroying itself from within.
@JP agree with your comments but not so sure how natural some of the strength and stamina is. Looks very unnatural when you stand back and look at their physique and how it changes in a short space of time as well as the ability to run longer than everyone else.
@justoutsideballagh, I know they had expertise purely to put in place a program for repeatable 3/4 pace running, tempo running.
It’s why McCarthy and Kilkenny, big men in clear space don’t run even 2% quicker than they need to. If they did it crosses their threshold for repeatable 3/4 pace and they start to flag eventually.
Also, they take breathers and get the opposition to chase down the ball.
Mullin to midfield! Where did you here that first? Yes I was advocating that before the Tipp match. I have watched Oisin since u12 when he slaughtered us on several occasions in club matches. He was always playing outfield and an amazing play maker.
Hold onto him no matter what!
FDB
The brother asked the questions off the customers why they wanted Dubs to win and those were the answers he relayed to my good self…I have no reason to add any meat to it….